From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Mon Jul 7 12:09:51 1997 Date: Mon, 7 Jul 1997 08:43:44 -0700 (PDT) From: Tom Nicholas To: bmwmcNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Subject: BMW: No BMW, Insurance Questions Reply-To: Tom Nicholas Hello All, I have recently been approached by Farmers Insurance and after sitting down with them and comparing policies, they can save me about $200/year. I currently have all my insurance with State Farm. They've been pretty good, although their rates have gone up some. State Farm (a different agent) was very generous to a friend of mine when he low sided his K75. My concern is, why are their rates so low? Is it because they don't pay out as generously as State Farm? Or is there some other reason? Anyone have any experience with Farmers? TIA, Tom. ============================================================================= Tom Nicholas - Vancouver, USA '90 K75RT - techno bike '69 350 SS Sprint - my hardley '55 F-100 - luddite cage Good judgement comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgement. - Mark Twain From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Mon Jul 7 13:29:04 1997 From: bkeaheyNoSpam@NoSpamuswest.com To: tom nicholas , bmwmcNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Date: Mon, 7 Jul 1997 09:43:33 MDT Subject: Re: BMW: No BMW, Insurance Questions Reply-To: bkeaheyNoSpam@NoSpamuswest.com Addressed to: Tom Nicholas bmwmcNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com ** Reply to note from Tom Nicholas Mon, 7 Jul 1997 08:43:44 -0700 (PDT) > I have recently been approached by Farmers Insurance and after sitting > down with them and comparing policies, they can save me about $200/year. > > I currently have all my insurance with State Farm. They've been pretty > good, although their rates have gone up some. State Farm (a different > agent) was very generous to a friend of mine when he low sided his K75. > > My concern is, why are their rates so low? Is it because they don't pay > out as generously as State Farm? Or is there some other reason? Anyone > have any experience with Farmers? I have four vehicles insured with State Farm: 1 car, 1 pickup, 2 bikes. So in addition to the accident-free discount, I get all the multi-vehicle discounts too. I've often been tempted to try to cuts cost (one of the new station did a story recently comparing ins. rates in CO), and I probably could save some. Then I remember the very generous no-questions asked settlement I received from State Farm in '95 when I went down in a cone-zone on my K75. been tempted to try to s Bruce G. Keahey, U S WEST Advanced Technologies, Boulder, CO "I am taking the advice of all the people who told me, 'Hey kid, go play in traffic!'" From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Mon Jul 7 17:10:49 1997 Date: Mon, 7 Jul 1997 13:16:27 -0700 To: bmwmcNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com From: Michael Fletcher Subject: BMW: Insurance, an attorney's view Reply-To: Michael Fletcher I found a brochure with the following information will at a BMW dealer in Portland, Oregon. I received permission to post it to the mail list. The only disclaimer is it is from an attorney that is a motorcyclist. Motorcycle Insurance Tune-Up: '97 Courtesy of Sam Hochberg AIM Attorney for Oregon Nobody likes to think about going down. But, bike or car, you've got to be prepared with the right information, legal advice, and above all, the right insurance. "But I've got full coverage." No you don't, unless you have HIGH LIMITS of uninsured/underinsured! Uninsured/Underinsured Motorist (UM?UIM): By far this is THE MOST IMPORTANT COVERAGE you need, bike, truck, or car. Buy the highest limits yu can. This protects you, your passenger, and even relatives in your household for injuries in any UM/UIM wreck for medicals, pain and suffering, lost wages, and future losses. You still need a lawyer to wring the money out of your own company, but at least there will be something there to get at, if you have high limits. UM/UIM is used when it's some else's fault, and they either have no insurance, or not enough insurance to cover your damages. Oregon requires: "25-50" (same as with liability) which means up to $25,000 per person; not enough in most bike accidents. WHAT TO BUY: As much UM as you can. Not less than $100,000 per person, more if you can. It is not too expensive. One way to pay for more UM is to raise the deductibles (your "co-pay") in your collision and comprehensive policies. UM/UIM is "Jerk Insurance:" If a covered person is hurt, your UM/UIM stands in the shoes of the jerk who hit you, and who should have had insurance, or more insurance. Your own company, however, then becomes your enemy, (even if they act nicely) and you ordinarily need a lawyer to get a fair settlement. (You're probably not "In Good Hands with ..."). And if you have high UM/UIM limits, you've got a shot at a better settlement, so you don't end up short, owing money. A broken bone or two, or even lesser injuries can rack up very high medical bills and lost wages that can eat up your settlement. Just ask someone who's been down without enough insurance. Underinsured Coverage (UIM) is the same as UM< except it adds to the other guy's limits, up to your total limits, if his policy isn't big enough to handle your claim. You automatically have as much UIM as you do UM. If You've Been Hurt in an accieent, neighter your UM/UIM onor the other guy's insurance will get you money up front. Usually, your best settlement will come at the end, after you are "medically stationary," when your doctors and lawyer can assess the full extent of all your presnet and future damages. There are usually no interim payouts, except for property damage and PIP (see below). Short term money problems may happen if you don't have medical insurance and some savings. Your lawyer may be able to at least keep medical creditors at bay until settlement. If yu are hurt, call a personal injury lawyer. Liability: Also known as "BI" (bodily injury). Your BI pays for someone else's injuries, not yours, only if an accident is your fault. Likewise the other guy's BI pays you if it's his fault. This is for all damages, present and future, including pain and suffering, except for property damage. Oregon requires "25-50", or up to $25,000 coverage for each person's claim per accident, and $50,000 for all claimants combined for each accident. That's very inadequate. WHAT TO BUY: Get at least "50-100", preferably "100-300" or even more. If you hurt someone else on a bike, it is likely to be your passenger. You want that person to get a decent monetary recovery if there's a serious injury. And whoever is hurt, you don't want their lawyer to come after you personally and take yur property, just because your BI insurance limits were too low. Property Damage (P/D): Your PD pays for damage you do to someone else's property. Oregon requires a minimum of $10,000. Buying more doesn't hurt, since most new cars and bikes cost more than that these days. This does not cover your own bike. That's under either Collision, Comprehensive, or UM/PD. Uninsured Motorist for Property Damage (UM/PD): There is no minimum requirement under Oregon law. It's a good buy, and usually fairly cheap, but if you already have collision coverage, it's probably not necessary. As the name implies, UM/PD covers damage to your bike if it's the other driver's fault and that driver has no insurance. UM/PD may also pay for your leathers and helmet damage, while collision ordinarily won't. Also, UM/PD typically has no deductible. PIP: is Personal Injury Protection, but it's not a lot of protection. PIP covers a limited amount of "reasonable and necessary" medical bills (usually up to $10,000 for one year), lost income (minimum is 70% of your gross, up to $1,250 a month), and loss of household services for you and your passenger, REGARDLESS OF FAULT. Bills should be paid quickly, ordinarily within a few weeks or months. Oregon requires: NOT REQUIRED for bikes, mandatory for most private cars and trucks. WHAT TO BUY: Usually very costly for bikes. If you and your usual passenger(s) have health insurance, you don't need PIP, although then you won't have it for lost wages. You should be able to recoup lost wages later, from the BI or your own UM, assuming there's enough coverage. COLLISION: Just covers your bike, minus a deductible, for damage from a crash of any sort, regardless of fault. Not required, except by finance companies to protect their loan. It's not cheap, but the higher your deductible, the cheaper the premiums. Comprehensive: Also just covers the bike, but for other losses, such as fire and theft. Not required by law, but usually worthwhile to add. Higher deductibles also get you cheaper premiums. Umbrella: The Cadillac of insurance, it's best to get it for both UM and BI, if you can. It picks up where your regular policy leaves off, usually up to $1,000,000. It requires underlyingcoverage, ordinarily at least $100,000 per person. If you buy it from the same company where you have your underlying policy, you may be able to get an umbrella for about another $100 - $150 a year. Premiums: Once you figure out what types of coverage you want for your bike or car, compare rates with other carriers. They can and do vary widely. Call agents, including your own, and some independent brokers. Towing: Surprisingly, often very cheap to add, especially on autos. Not required by Oregon law. Check out the private towing policies for bikes that are similar to triple-A, such as MTS (Motorcycle Touring Service, pays most of the tow, some restrictions, costs about $50 a year, 1-800-999-7064), BRO's (through Easyriders magazine), and other programs through HOG, GWRRA, and other groups. Doj't forget your free ABATE road list, and AIM volunteers may be available nationally at 1-800-531-2424. If You Are Injured: The first and last rule: DO NOT TALK to any insurance people without first consulting an injury lawyer. Not about ANYTHING. Remember, the adjuster's job is to find every excuse to pay you as little as possible, whether it's your own company or not. Just because you are in the right doesn't mean things won't end up slanted against you by the adjuster. You may not even think you are hurt after an accident, say so to the adjuster, but discover later your injuries are much worse. You've just damaged your case. Just say "no." Dont talk to the adjuster. This can make a huge difference in how well you do. The opposing adjuster also won't help you to get your claim handled properly under your underinsured (UIM) policy, and could easily take actions that would ruin your UIM claim. Be safe. Call any good personal injury lawyer, including any AIM lawyer. At least get a free phone consultation. Call an attorney that does a lot of personal injury work regularly. Questions: For questions about your car or bike insurance, or regarding any kind of accident claim, please feel free to call me or one of my able legal assistants, Ann, Don or Gunny, at no charge, at 503-224-1106. Outside the Portland area, call me direct, toll-free, at 1-800-347-1106. Caveats: Insurance regulations and case law change, and they vary from state to state. Check with your agent, or call me or the AIM attorney in your state for a free insurance review. If you've had an accident, this article is not designed to show you how to handle your claim on your own! Free Talks: As a service of the AIM program, I will speak to your motorcycle group and answer questions about insurance, tickets accidents, and other matters. Call to set up a time. It's fun for me, and your members will appreciate getting free legal advice. Ride Safe! The info made me reevaluate my Dairyland policy and to realize why it cost less than some of the others. My policy is very restricted on coverage limits. You get what you pay for, I guess but higher coverage limits just aren't available through Dairyland so I will be shopping for better coverage. Michael Chandler, AZ R 100 Mystic "Memsahib" From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Mon Jul 7 17:29:27 1997 From: Hosmann95NoSpam@NoSpamaol.com Date: Mon, 7 Jul 1997 17:00:57 -0400 (EDT) To: bmwmcNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Subject: BMW: Re: No BMW, Insurance Questions Reply-To: Hosmann95NoSpam@NoSpamaol.com << My concern is, why are their rates so low? Is it because they don't pay out as generously as State Farm? Or is there some other reason? Anyone have any experience with Farmers? >> Funny, I made the exact same move about a year ago. Despite having State Farm insurance for 6 years without a single claim or speeding ticket, they wrote me one day to announce that they were going to about DOUBLE my car insurance cost. Apparently the California Insurance Commission OKed their rate increase across the board because they were crying about not making enough profit in the state. Profit isn't a dirty word, but $2,000/year to insure a Saturn (in Sacramento) without a single point on my licence brought some other words to mind. Anyway, my agent apologized and tried to get me to stay touting the "relationship" I had formed with State Farm over six years (a one way relationship apparently). Needless to say, I priced a lot of insurance in the next week and jumped to Farmers. I saved a lot of money on the car insurance (about $400/year) but my motorcycle coverage went up a little bit. I was still paying more than I had been with State Farm prior to the rate hike, however. Fortunately, I have still never needed to make an insurance claim, so I can't speak to how well they pay off. In terms of reputation, however, I couldn't find anyone who had a bad experience to share about Farmers in particular. I have always been wary in the past, however, of small no-name carriers for this reason. Before jumping over, try going to your agent and sharing the rates Farmers offered you. They might want to keep you badly enough to match the offer, especially if you have homeowners and other cars on the policy. From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Mon Jul 7 21:46:49 1997 Date: Mon, 07 Jul 1997 20:32:23 -0700 From: Tom schirz To: bmwmc CC: EsquireTedNoSpam@NoSpamaol.com Subject: BMW: Insurance Questions Reply-To: Tom schirz Ted, Been with Natonal General 8 years; paying $324/yr w 200ded, 2 beemers and 1hond 50cc; payed for 2 dingers so far with no hassles. 18003251190. Happy hunting, Tomas , que whiner :( 1963 R 60 #624 857 followed me home from oktoberfest 1968 R 60 + Avon fairing, traded for JD 140 1987 K 75T #0131643 old blu gone to new home 1984 R 80 RT Red Rider for the rain 1993 K 1100RS nu blu; throttle & grin stuck on open From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Tue Jul 8 11:23:01 1997 From: "Rickey E. Chevrie" Subject: Re: BMW: Dairyland Insurance Company To: beverleyNoSpam@NoSpamcompuserve.com Date: Tue, 8 Jul 1997 10:03:13 -0500 (CDT) Cc: bmwmcNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Reply-To: "Rickey E. Chevrie" According to Nick Pettefar: > > > I'm thinking of getting insurance with this company. > They offer insurance for non-US driving licence > holders and for short-terms. I want full coverage > for two months of BMWing. > > Does anybody have anything for or against this Company? > I'm getting the cover via an agency called Berglund > Insurance Agency in Arizona. They were very helpful > on the telephone and faxed me the forms. Everything > seems to be OK and foreigners well catered for. I just > have to provide a fax of my International or UK licence > and passport. The rest is down to dollars via the Visa > network... > > > > Cheers, > > Nick > > Howdy Nick! I have had Dairyland insurance for 5 years now. They had the best rates for me. I haven't made any claims yet, but when I asked this question the answers I received didn't dissuade me. Regards Rick From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Tue Jul 8 15:05:59 1997 Date: Tue, 08 Jul 1997 13:18:46 -0700 From: L G Burnett <"buddyburNoSpam@NoSpambellsouth.net"NoSpam@NoSpamBellsouth.net> To: beverleyNoSpam@NoSpamcompuserve.com Cc: BMWMCNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Subject: Re: BMW: Dairyland Insurance Company Reply-To: L G Burnett <"buddyburNoSpam@NoSpambellsouth.net"NoSpam@NoSpamBellsouth.net> Nick Pettefar wrote: > > I'm thinking of getting insurance with this company. > They offer insurance for non-US driving licence > holders and for short-terms. I want full coverage Dairyland was about the only company that would offer insurance on my K100 EML sidecar rig as a package deal. The other companies I contacted wanted to insure the sidecar as an accessory, but that bumped the rates so high as to be almost uninsurable. I've had no claims, so the rates have steadily decreased over the years. It didn't hurt that I'm an MSF certified instructor and have continuosly owned motorcycles for over 30 years. Buddy Burnett From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Tue Jul 8 19:45:27 1997 From: LawsonCLNoSpam@NoSpamaol.com Date: Tue, 8 Jul 1997 19:25:05 -0400 (EDT) To: bmwmcNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Subject: BMW: RE: BMW F650ST -- Okay I'm new--no reason to get screwed. Reply-To: LawsonCLNoSpam@NoSpamaol.com >>Its 1300 a year for me to have full coverage on the 650st, if I pick up a 94 yamaha seca-II, insurance is 1600 for full coverage. I checked a bunch of bikes, whatever I buy new is cheaper it seems. (this makes no sense to me)<< Hey, don't buy a motorcycle. Buy a gun. Shoot your insurance agent*. Then call Universal Underwriters or find a motorcycle dealer in your town who reps for UU. With the money you save, you'll have easily covered the cost of the gun and be able to pay for 2 or 3 years of insurance. Look, new guy, I have two, count them "two" 1995 1000cc BMWs, an LT and a GS/PD. They charge me $340.00 per year for BOTH bikes. Full coverage. Unless you have the driving record from hell and have rightfully earned your victim status, get that gun. Or the family-size drum of Vaseline. Chris Lawson BOOF #15 R100LT R100GS/PD *Figuratively speaking, of course. From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Tue Jul 8 22:37:12 1997 Date: Mon, 7 Jul 1997 21:14:32 -0800 To: bmwmcNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com, ldriderNoSpam@NoSpamyucca.anv.net, bmw-r1100NoSpam@NoSpamcinnamon.com From: jfbrownNoSpam@NoSpampower.net (J.F. Brown) Subject: BMW: NGIC Insurance Quote Reply-To: jfbrownNoSpam@NoSpampower.net (J.F. Brown) Hi All, Thought you folks would like to hear of my *very happy* experience with National General Insurance Company (NGIC), 800/847-2886 x6148. When I got my 97 R1100RT back in April, I first called several insurance companies to get quotes for full coverage. I've had liability-only on my 1983 R80ST from McGraw for 10 years. Cost is $113/yr. McGraw wanted an additional $789/yr for full coverage on the RT, for a total of $902/yr (R11RT - full w/$350 deductable, R80ST - liability only). AAA wanted $927/yr for the same coverage ($500 deductable). NGIC had the lowest quote for their "touring rider coverage", $559 for full coverage ($200 deductable), including up to $1500 coverage on accessories, on the RT. Needless to say, I went with them. The liability-only coverage from McGraw for the ST ended 6/23. Cost to renew was $113/yr. I called NGIC for a quote and got a price of $66 (pro-rated from June to April). Needless to say, I went with them. The added coverage for the ST was attached as a rider to my existing policy on the RT. NGIC also said there would be a discount for multiple vehicle coverage. Cool, I thought. When I got the envelope in the mail for the added coverage from NGIC, much to my surprise they enclosed, instead of a bill, a check from *them* to *me* in the amount of $14. It's cheaper to have both bikes covered than just one! Since NGIC is a subsidiary of GM, I don't think they qualify as a small, shakey, fly-by-night kinda company. But I've wondered why their premiums are so low compared to others. My conclusion is that they are "skimming" off touring riders, who tend to be older, established, professional types with decades of riding experience, clean records (for the most part! :), who ride non-squid type bikes such as BMW's. And who don't put in a lot of claims. NGIC will be getting my motorcycle insurance business from now on! J.F. Brown 1983 R80ST "NO PIKL" 1997 R11RT "NOIR RAD" +----------------------------------------------+ | jfbrownNoSpam@NoSpampower.net (J.F. Brown) | | Net Surfin' from Manhattan Beach, California | +----------------------------------------------+ From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Wed Jul 9 15:57:46 1997 From: BLewis2099NoSpam@NoSpamaol.com Date: Wed, 9 Jul 1997 15:28:54 -0400 (EDT) To: jfbrownNoSpam@NoSpampower.net, bmwmcNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com, ldriderNoSpam@NoSpamyucca.anv.net, bmw-r1100NoSpam@NoSpamcinnamon.com Subject: Re: BMW: NGIC Insurance Quote Reply-To: BLewis2099NoSpam@NoSpamaol.com In a message dated 97-07-09 07:36:41 EDT, jfbrownNoSpam@NoSpampower.net (J.F. Brown) writes: << My conclusion is that they are "skimming" off touring riders, who tend to be older, established, professional types with decades of riding experience, clean records (for the most part! :), who ride non-squid type bikes such as BMW's. And who don't put in a lot of claims. >> That and they do not have agents so they save the commisions and related expenses. I now have my house, bike, and other vehicles. Each policy was lower then I had before. Only had one small claim which they paid prombtly. Bill Lewis Roanoke, Virginia 1980 R100T (former R100RT) From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Sun Jul 13 23:16:36 1997 From: DMAUST01NoSpam@NoSpamULKYVM.LOUISVILLE.EDU Date: Sun, 13 Jul 97 22:56:42 EDT To: bmwmcNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Subject: BMW: good experiences with insurance Reply-To: DMAUST01NoSpam@NoSpamULKYVM.LOUISVILLE.EDU I just wanted to report on GOOD experiences with Midwest Mutual Insurance. The policy on my bikes includes a "Tourider Ultra Endorsement" which covers emergency road service. I have used this option three times in the past 1.5 years. My most recent experience involved a disabled starter in Springfield, IL. I had to spend three nights in a motel waiting for a replacement starter and installation. The insurance covered my tow, three nights lodging, and meals. I am not an employ of Midwest Mutual,.....just a satisfied customer. Mark Austin From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Thu Jul 17 10:47:37 1997 Date: 17 Jul 1997 07:25:50 -0800 From: "Jacobs, Dennis" Subject: BMW: RE: USAA To: bmwmcNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Reply-To: "Jacobs, Dennis" I've actually had USAA insurance for 17 years. They are great for auto = and home. Super customer service. They recently added MC insurance but were not as = competetive as National General. $350 vs $210/yr for K1100RS. I talked = to USAA yesterday and they said they will be adding a new company in the = near future that will be available for civilians. So far I'm happy with = National General but then again I've never put in a claim with them. From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Mon Jul 21 10:51:23 1997 Date: Sat, 19 Jul 1997 07:50:28 -0700 From: Mark Gensman Organization: Business Resource Group, Inc. To: BMWMC mailing list Subject: BMW: Tickets and higher rates Reply-To: Mark Gensman Once again a reminder to all. Geico insurance gives free lazer guns to the police in areas where they have large numbers of insurance holders. Three tickets and your rates double. Also, in Oregon, you can get an energy conservation ticket that costs you some money, but does not affect your record. We got three tickets for 75 in a 55 and they cost $150.00 each but a nice letter to the judge reduced two of the three (Not mine!) to $75. Geico sucks. -- Mark Gensman MgensmanNoSpam@NoSpamix.netcom.com 95 K1100LT "You're never too old to rock and roll" K-Whiner #51 "The Green Hornet" From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Mon Jul 21 16:51:19 1997 To: bmwmcNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com From: Court Fisher Subject: BMW: Re: NYC insurance...stoopid questions Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 20:30:59 +0000 Reply-To: Court Fisher >Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 13:05:35 -0400 >From: VASUDEV.SUDARSANANoSpam@NoSpamchase.com >Subject: BMW: stoopid questions >some questions for NYC dwellers if there are any : > >Insurance Rates : My '79 R65 is insured by Progressive and I'm paying >$490 per year for >minimum liability (25/50) and underinsured motorist coverage. >something tells me i'm being ripped >off. Could anyone tell me where I could get lower rates. BTW I'm 28, >male, and single. SNIP >TIA, >Vasu ------------------ I'm not a NYC dweller, but I'd still suggest you try two 'local' insurance agents who broker Universal Underwriters and perhaps other bike specialty insurance companies: 1. Moto-Trans, Inc. 516-427-9234, in Huntington LI; 2. Mike Mandell, Inc., 800-245-8726 or 516-822-1237, in Jericho LI. good luck, Court Fisher Princeton NJ all the usual suspect acronyms court.fisherNoSpam@NoSpamworldnet.att.net From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Mon Jul 28 21:49:54 1997 From: MOTOCOMNoSpam@NoSpamaol.com Date: Mon, 28 Jul 1997 21:37:17 -0400 (EDT) To: bmwmcNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Subject: BMW: Progressive/A.M.A. Discounts Reply-To: MOTOCOMNoSpam@NoSpamaol.com Glad to report that, if you are a member of the A.M.A. and have Progressive insurance for your bike(s) you get a 5% discount. And, if you have completed a Motorcycle Safety Foundation Course you get a 10% discount. And, if you have 3 progressive motorcycle policies with Progressive, you get a 15% discount. All good news. Maybe if you don't smoke, crash and your cholesterol is under 200, who knows if you could get another discount in the future. Guy "Turbofrog" Laronche I.O.G., G.O.B, I.B.B.O., A.M.A., I.B.M.C., M.O.A. From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Fri Aug 8 16:56:08 1997 Date: Fri, 8 Aug 1997 15:45:22 -0400 From: Daniel Quick Subject: BMW: Useful UK insurance news To: BlindCopyReceiver:;;NoSpam@NoSpamcompuserve.comNoSpam@NoSpamfacteur.std.com Reply-To: Daniel Quick X-No-Archive: yes Recent useful add ons to Norwich Union Premier Bike Policies: Protected NCD available on all policies Bike Gold provides Europe wide RAC cover including car hire etc *but* it doesn't include personal repatriation in the event of accident (= no air ambulance etc) Still a bargain for =A328 annually Personal Gold is designed for clothing, helmet insurance etc. but only on= Comp policies Useful 'phone no for info is Norwich Union ClubLine on: 0800 678999 also NU Premier Bike now *includes* = Green Card Bail Bond! 365 day cover Safe Riding Daniel Quick = dlquickNoSpam@NoSpamcompuserve.com http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/dlquick Oxford UK Flautist Extraordinaire :-) From BlgzaNoSpam@NoSpamaol.com Date: Fri, 15 Aug 1997 10:02:15 -0400 (EDT) From: BlgzaNoSpam@NoSpamaol.com Subject: Re: BMW: Insurance for my 'Stich In a message dated 97-08-14 20:21:57 EDT, you write: << I seem to remember reading in the last Insurance thread about insuring riding suits. I had never thought about it, seems like a good idea. So I called my Insurace agent and asked to have coverage for my 'Stich added to my policy (Dairyland) she got back to me and said they don't offer insurance for clothing. This seemed odd to me, since I had read about other Prezzes having coverage. Now she is checking with Progressive, havent heard back yet. Any help from anybody who has coverage for their riding suits??? >> I can help here....I own an insurance agency in Ohio...While the policy's differ slightly from state to state in the coverages offered, they generally cover the same stuff... You riding suit is considered personal property, therefore would be covered under your homeowners policy...I would recommend, as with anything of substantial value (jewelry, antiques, collectibles, etc.), that you document it's value, and your ownership of it...i.e. pictures, reciepts....Even a better idea, take your (or your friend's, parent's) camcorder and go through your entire home (apt, condo, etc) filming your closets, drawers, rooms, anything of any value, and make sure the date/time is on the screen. Take this tape to work or a relative's/friend's home, so if your house burns down you have a record of your stuff...do this every time your policy renews.... Again, I practice in Ohio, call your agent and make sure the same rule's apply in your state....Remember, ask about personal property coverage on your homeowners policy for your riding suit...Hope this helped a bit...Good luck...Steve... From jrocheNoSpam@NoSpammailer.fsu.edu (jim roche) Date: Wed, 3 Sep 1997 22:39:40 -0400 (EDT) Subject: BMW: Insurance Recommendations > >Date: Wed, 03 Sep 1997 19:57:58 -0600 >From: John McClellan >Subject: BMW: Insurance Recommendations? > >Anyone care to make any recommendations for bike insurance? > >John McClellan >jjmNoSpam@NoSpamshanwil.com > >--------- Dear John, Progressive. 10% off to BMWMOA or RA members. Prompt and fair service. 24hr service card. Fair rates. Ect. Best, Jim(Dr.Curve)Roche jrocheNoSpam@NoSpammailer.fsu.edu high performance old twins http://garnet.acns.fsu.edu/~jroche/index.html From Cal Swallow Date: Wed, 03 Sep 1997 23:53:30 -0500 Subject: Re: BMW: Insurance Recommendations? At 07:57 P 9/3/97 -0600, you wrote: > >Anyone care to make any recommendations for bike insurance? > >John McClellan >jjmNoSpam@NoSpamshanwil.com > Yes, Farmers Insurance Co. ---'94 R1100 RSL full coverage year round <$180.00 ---Prompt payment of claims. Ya gotta have a cage insured with them first if ya want 'em to write up your bike. Cal Swallow NOTICE: Due to inflation, my $.02 worth is now Quincy, IL now going for $.03. BMWMOA # 65821 1985 K100 LT Grey Primer (don't ask) 1994 R1100 RSL (so I'm fickle) Turkisgrun Met. (fastest color) From Jon Zurell Date: Thu, 04 Sep 1997 02:56:08 -0400 Subject: Re: BMW: Insurance Recommendations >Dear John, Progressive. 10% off to BMWMOA or RA members. Prompt and fair > All I might add that Progressive gives a higher discount to AMA members than it does to BMWMOA members....at least that is what the folks in Indiana told me. Jon From BlgzaNoSpam@NoSpamaol.com Date: Thu, 4 Sep 1997 10:44:23 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: BMW: Insurance Recommendations? In a message dated 97-09-04 10:25:37 EDT, you write: << Anyone care to make any recommendations for bike insurance? >> Try Progressive, but go through an agent, don't call their 1800 #....they have excellent rates on bikes like BMW's and harley's, mainly because they dont go that fast (compared to the crotch rocket's). On the other hand, they are terrible for the crotch rocket's....The big thing with Progressive is that you have proof of 6 months prior insurance. From Glenn Miller Date: Thu, 4 Sep 1997 07:45:23 -0700 Subject: BMW: RE: Insurance Recommendations? John, I can recommend avoiding the McGraw company, I am on my fifth phone call, fourth letter in only two months of coverage. They first wrote the wrong coverage, duplicating what was on my title, not what was on my insurance app, the premium has changed three times(initial quote, quote including wife, quote with me- but some how higher than initial quote). I even called another agent and asked for a quote on a McGraw policy and the quote was the same as my initial quote from my agent. Apparently that is a teaser to get you in. I'm following this thread to find a new policy--so good hunting! Glenn Miller 85 K100RS From leefNoSpam@NoSpamlocalnet.com Thu Sep 11 03:08:08 1997 Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 03:06:50 -0400 To: thundtNoSpam@NoSpamslack.net From: Lee Freedman Subject: Re: BMW: insurance in BC? Cc: bmwmcNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com At 10:20 PM -0000 10/9/97, Thomas Hundt wrote: >[Lee Freedman rants a bit on how very lame it is to ride w/o >insurance. Thus saving me time and energy...] > >|It's for people like your "friend" that I pay extra money to carry >|Uninsured Motorist Coverage on my bike and car! > >So... what happens if you don't? Just what does this cover >(or protect you from), anyway? What it protects you from or what it covers you for is recovering damages when you are involved in a collision with someone who has no insurance. Basically, you sue your own insurance company. If you don't have UIM protection, then you are out of pocket for whatever damages result, while the other guy walks. You can also get Underinsured Motorist Protection which covers you in case the other party doesn't have sufficient coverage to pay for the damage. Believe it or not, there is a huge amount of people out there, driving around without any insurance, either because they can't afford it or are gambling that they will not be involved in an accident. In some states where proof of insurance is required to register a vehicle, a common dodge is to put a small down payment on the insurance, get the registration and then let the insurance expire without making any further payments. > >Also: which part of a policy covers your pillion? You would have to check your policy or check with your agent as to whether or not a passenger is covered under the terms of your policy. My guess would be that a passenger on a motorcycle is not covered for injury. It is possible that if you have a passenger and are involved in an accident resulting in injury to the passenger, that the passenger can sue you to recover for any damages or injury suffered in the accident, regardless of who is at fault. If you regularly ride with a passenger, I would make sure I was covered for this contingency. I'm neither an insurance agent or a lawyer and it's possible that some of this information is incorrect. However, I have had situations in the past involving uninsured motorists, so I am somewhat familiar with the general aspects of the procedure. Hope this info helps. > >Thanks, > > NoSpam@NoSpam Tom Hundt http://www.slack.net/~thundt/ > -_/L> '86 K100RS San Francisco CA USA W=+1-415/597-2216 > ()7=() Saved IBMWR articles --> http://slack.net/~thundt/Bmw/index.htm Best regards Lee Freedman Buffalo Bozo Date: Thu, 16 Oct 1997 11:57:01 -0500 From: Brent Jass Subject: No BMW: Insurance Fellow Prezzes: For years, I've been paying Progressive about $93/year to insure my '75 R75/6. The details: Bodily Injury Liability: $30,000/person, $60,000/accident Property Damage Liability: $10,000/accident Guest Passenger Liability: $30,000/person, $60,000/accident Comprehensive: $250 Deductible The comprehensive is optional, but the rest is required by Minnesota law. When I got my '88 K75S a couple months ago, I called my agent and asked him what the same coverage would cost for this bike, and he said $46 a year. I figured he was making some mistake, and so did he, but he checked and rechecked and kept coming up with $46/year. So I asked him how much collision insurance would add to that, and he said that with a $250 deductible it'd be $38/year, and it would include $1000 of custom parts and equipment (my "crash bags" are covered!). I couldn't believe it, but I told him I'd send a check right away for $85, which included a $1 Minnesota assessment. In the meantime, I've been asking other riders what they're paying, but no one I've spoken to so far pays this little. I received the papers from Progressive that spell out the details. Everything looks fine to me. Did someone make a mistake? Is there something I should look for in my policy papers? I suspected that I might be insuring a 75cc motorcycle, but the policy papers show "750" in the cc's column. What are others paying? I'm 37 and married, with no claims, no accidents, and no tickets for about 15 years and I live in a sparsely-populated area, so I probably should get about as good a rate as anyone. But why is it cheaper to insure the K than the /6? My agent doesn't have an answer for that one. My biggest worry is that I'll file a claim someday, only to find out I didn't have the insurance I thought I had. Brent '88 K75S '75 R75/6 Date: Fri, 17 Oct 1997 13:46:53 -0400 (EDT) From: EbolanowNoSpam@NoSpamaol.com Subject: BMW: Re: BMW Insurance My God, man, your driving record must be an insurance companies wet dream. I insure both of my bikes (1994 Honda CBR 600 F2 and 1998 BMW R1200C) out of Florida (although I have only just recently gotten a NYS license) and pay NoSpam@NoSpam600 simoleans to All-State Insurance. I have to admit though, they have treated me right proper when I have had auto problems. Best, Edward In a message dated 10/17/97 10:46:06 AM EST, you write: > When I got my '88 K75S a couple months ago, I called my agent and asked > him what the same coverage would cost for this bike, and he said $46 a > year. I figured he was making some mistake, and so did he, but he > checked and rechecked and kept coming up with $46/year. > > So I asked him how much collision insurance would add to that, and he > said that with a $250 deductible it'd be $38/year, and it would include > $1000 of custom parts and equipment (my "crash bags" are covered!). I > couldn't believe it, but I told him I'd send a check right away for $85, > which included a $1 Minnesota assessment. > > In the meantime, I've been asking other riders what they're paying, but > no one I've spoken to so far pays this little. I received the papers > from Progressive that spell out the details. Everything looks fine to > me. Date: Fri, 17 Oct 1997 15:26:52 -0400 From: James Allmond Subject: RE: BMW: Laser Toast Not a clue, got out of the Insurance biz a couple of years ago and ain't looking back! James At 13:35 10/17/97 -0400, you wrote: >So who i selling/manufacturing laser detectors now? > >Robert > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: James Allmond [SMTP:bigjamesNoSpam@NoSpamix.netcom.com] >> Sent: Friday, October 17, 1997 1:04 PM >> To: bmwmcNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com >> Subject: Re: BMW: Laser Toast >> >> >> Mark Gensman wrote: >> >> >Once again, I remind all who participate in the radar thread that >> most >> >laser guns were given free of charge to the police by Geico >> Insurance. >> >Of course their rates go up when you get multiple tickets.. >> >> Mark, >> >> I worked for GEICO when they gave those out. They stopped when they >> discovered >> a few things: >> >> 1) The Police were not using them correctly, they are supposed to be >> mounted >> on a solid object, not hand held. LOTS of tickets beat that way. >> >> 2) Safety issues concerning users of the device. Apparently they are >> kinda >> hot radioactivewise for appliances >> >> 3) BAD PR >> >> 4) Wanted out of the Laser business, they were buying and distributing >> all >> of the product. >> >> They got into the Laser thing because the company that makes them was >> about to >> go belly up. I know the folks who made the decisions, as much as I >> hate to >> admit it. They really looked at it as a public safety issue. Their 2 >> main companies >> GEICO and GEICO General DO NOT charge for tickets, they do underwrite >> on them though. >> I know, I used to rate, sell, (and later) did statical analisys for >> them. CycleGard, >> Geico Indemnity and GEICO Casualty all charge for speeding tickets. >> These companies >> insure bikes, bad drivers and worse drivers respectively. >> >> No, I am not really fond of GEICO (or the industry as a whole) either, >> but want to >> make sure the record is set straight. >> >> >> James Allmond >> Macon, Ga >> 87 R80RT >> and when 2 wheels are not enough, >> 88 FLHS/Watsonian >> 51 Servicar >> and yes sometimes you need 4 wheels >> 69 Dodge Dart Swinger 340 (4 wheels does not need to be boring) > Date: Mon, 27 Aug 1956 22:48:32 +0000 From: Ayla and Jim Douglas Subject: BMW: Insurance Just a quick comparison. Ayla and I have two bikes, we are with National General. Our Allstate man handles our Grand Cherokee and our house, and told us to forget their motorcycle coverage because the main office really did not care to cover bikes, therefor the rates were not at all competitive. We have a '93 K1100RSA and an R1100RA, hard bags on each, though that would not matterbecause the are BMWs, they are automatically in the touring catagory. We live in the city limits of Sacramento and are in a Zip Code area which includes some of the tougher parts of town....strangest shape zip area I have ever seen.... At any rate, we pay about $380 per year. That is for 50/100,25k property damage, 15/30 passenger, $200 ded on comp and $250 on collision, with accessories covered up to $1500/200 ded (additional?) The funny thing to me is that the K is about $20 less than the R, even though it has so much more body work to mess up. Again, this is for Sacramento and I generally ride 15-20,000 mi or 23-30,000 km per year. Seems the gentleman who was getting an $85 quote may have been getting the rates partially based upon the fact that he can probably only ride it 6-9 months of the year. Where as I probably put on 2k miles average every month of the year. The gentleman in NY insuring from Fla, with Allstate, might check out National General or Progressive, he could surely save several hundred per year, I would guess. Jim Douglas jdouglasNoSpam@NoSpamvisionnet.net Date: Tue, 21 Oct 1997 10:37:53 -0700 From: Paul Egli To: thundtNoSpam@NoSpamslack.net Subject: infomonger motorcycle insurance another bit of info for your web page... i get my motorcycle insurance from: Inspro Agents & Brokers 1055 Sunnyvale Saratoga Rd Sunnyvale, CA 94087-2539 408-294-6028 --paul Date: Fri, 24 Oct 1997 11:52:21 -0400 (EDT) From: TMFBikerNoSpam@NoSpamaol.com Subject: BMW: Totaled bike - looking for advice Bob Anundson: >About four weeks a go I was hit by car. Fortunately I wasn=92t hurt but = I >learned today that the bike, '94 K75, was totaled. Any advice on how to >deal with the insurance company? Its the cars fault but the owner has >the same company as I. Bob, Remember all those times you paid $12 for an oil filter? Well now is the time to cash in. Go right to your dealer, pronto! Your dealer will know= far better then the insurance people what a K75 is really worth. Your dealer regularly works with insurance companies and knows how to convince the insurance people that your bike is worth more than the NADA book says. T= his works especially well if you are looking at a new or used replacement bik= e from said dealer. Many times the dealer will offer to deal directly with= the insurance company on your behalf in matters of fairly valuing the bike. ALSO....Get a few back issues on the Owner's news and your local Sunday newspaper for advertisements of like bikes. Try the Washington Post onli= ne at www.washingtonpost.com (BMW's get a premium around here...) Armed wit= h all of this knowlege, you will have a much stronger hand then were you to just take what they give. ~~~~~~~~~ http://users.aol.com/esquireted/moto.htm ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Ted Verrill - EsquireTedNoSpam@NoSpamaol.com - TedVNoSpam@NoSpamFool.com - K1100RS (Zephyr) Date: Fri, 24 Oct 1997 10:49:26 -0500 (CDT) From: Richard_Spurgeon_Jones Subject: Re: BMW: Bike Totaled - looking for advice When you settle with the ins company you will probably be given a chance to purchase your wrecked bike at salvage value. I recently purchased a wrecked k100 with a bent fork for $150.00. Since I already have a K100 this was a great deal for me. I should have enough parts to last forever. - ------------------------------------------------------------------- Richard Spurgeon Jones Jackson State Community College, Jackson Tennessee, USA Internet: rsj8757NoSpam@NoSpamorion.jscc.cc.tn.us Date: Fri, 21 Nov 1997 07:17:28 -0800 From: Roozbeh Chubak Subject: Re: BMW: State Farm MC insurance At 7:26 PM -0800 11/20/97, Robert W. Munday wrote: ><<< State Farm does not consider any BMW as a sport bike, and does NOT >give any discount for MSF classes. >>> > > > >With Dairyland, even with a great rate, I got a 10% discount for the MSF >course, a 10% discount for belonging to the BMWMOA and another discount >for renewing after the first year. If I stay with them long enough, they >may start paying me to insure with them. State farm does give other discounts well worth considering. I don't have the paperwork for my bikes readily accessible, but these are the numbers for my car on my just-received renewal form: Coverage (100/300, 250 deduct.) $1,113 Discount -- Multicar ($81) Discount -- Driver safety record ($558) Discount -- California good driver ($95) Balance: (actual premium): $397 This means I am saving 66% of my premium compared to someone with a lousy driving record (and only one car)! So... a Valentine One is a bloody good investment sice I ride about 35,000 miles a year (plus another 10,000 in my car)! Regards, Roozbeh Date: Mon, 22 Dec 1997 21:07:17 -0800 (PST) From: Victor Kimura Subject: BMW: Insurance Anybody have any experience with Touring Rider's Insurance Plan (TRIP)? They advertise about their low rates: "How can our rates be so much lower? It's because touring-class motorcycles are the only ones we insure. This means TRIP doesn't lump you together with riders in higher risk categories!" Victor ******************************************************* Victor Kimura Monterey Bay BMW Riders Santa Cruz, California IBMWR BOOF #92 1997 R1100RT (Gambaru) LSTC #2 1992 K75 (Mazaru) BMWMOA #76804 *******************************************************