From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Wed May 28 13:24:20 1997 Date: Wed, 28 May 1997 12:43:38 -0400 (EDT) From: Rick Povich To: Internet BMW Riders Subject: BMW: Another GPS mount for cycles X: I'd rather be two-wheelin' Reply-To: Rick Povich I was browsing the auto parts deparment at a local KMart the other day and discovered a radar detector mount that looked like it might work on my motorcycles with my Garmin 12XL. It was a simple metal V-shaped mount with 3 suction cups and a strip of velcro. Another strip of velcro is then attached to the GPS. I put the mount on the speedos of my 81 R100RT and PD (I.D. appx 3", the other appx 4") and they fit quite well and very securely. I took the PD for a 12 mile ride over varous rocky terrain and fire roads at speeds from about 10 mph up to about 40 mph with no sign of the mounts dislodging. My 12XL wiggled a bit, but it stayed put and worked without a hitch. I next took the 12XL on my RT for a 40 mile ride and it, too, worked without any sign of coming loose. The mounts have been on the bikes for about 4 days now and the suction cups are still holding strong. Overall I'm satisfied with the mounts. They are labeled "On The Road" brand Radar Detector Windshield Mount. I believe they cost about $3.50 or so. I happened to buy the last two they had in stock. The product number benewath the bar code is 76027 50398. I wasn't concerned about not being able to see my speedo because I usually don't pay attention to it, and besides the GPS will display the speed, and a bit more accurately than the BMW speedos. All in all, nice inexpensive GPS mounts. Hope that's of some help. Rick Povich ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Rick Povich University of Pittsburgh Media Producer Audiovisual Department SHUTTER+NoSpam@NoSpamPITT.EDU (814) 269-7103 Johnstown, Pa. 15904 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> < It's not whether you screw up, > < but how you recover that counts > < Squid Factor:18.99 DoD#032653 > <1976 R90/6 1981 R100RT 1991 R100GS/PD > < Paris Daycare Mudbog and Dirt Flingin' Society > < http://www.pitt.edu/~shutter > < N 40 17.697 W 78 59.867 > < Rambling, Chronically Bored #1 > <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Wed May 28 15:24:24 1997 Date: Wed, 28 May 1997 11:32:39 -0700 (PDT) From: Warren Harhay To: bmwmcNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Subject: BMW: GPS system used in 50CC Quest Reply-To: Warren Harhay A number of folks have asked about the GPS that I used on my 50CC run earlier this year. Here are some more details. The Garmin GPSMAP 195 is a handheld 12 channel GPS with a 4.1" (diagonal) LCD display that has all US and State Highways stored within its database _without_ any external cartridges. The map screen is hard to read at night even though it is back illuminated. The other text screens are fully legible during night driving. The unit is designed principally as an aircraft GPS and has additional air navigation data stored within as well. The unit displays a map of roadways, railroads, water features, state boundaries, city and town place names that moves along as you do. The screen is updated once per second. The map can be oriented either in a fixed mode or the display can rotate to synch with your direction of travel. It has a compass rose display, it can indicate track, velocity, ETA, altitude, fuel consumed, battery voltage, distance travelled, etc,etc,etc. It has bells, buzzers, timers, tracks, memories, and whistles and features that I will never use and would have to go back to school to use effectively. It is a great toy. The GPS195 is exactly alike the marine GPS175 with the exception of the internal database. The GPS175 is about $800.00 list butt, you must purchase cartridges costing $200 each. It is cheaper and more elegant to have everything internal for LD work IMHO. I bought my unit from Eastern Avionics. They are on the web and you can find them and other Garmin dealers through Yahoo. There is quite a lot of material on the web including all the details for the full Garmin line. The major problem with this unit is the price. My unit cost about $1,100. I justified it with the rational that I had a Magellan aircraft GPS that I sold for $800 feeling that the moving map feature was worth the extra $300 bucks. It is. A PC interface cable is available to update the aviation navigation database and to provide a GPS data stream. The unit comes with a mounting bracket that defies description. I used the cradle from it to fabricate my own mount on the R1100RTL. I used a homemake "L" shaped aluminum bracket mounted with the rear most set of cap screws (about 1/2" over stock) using 1/2" standoff bushings so as not to mar the polished surface of the handlebar mounts. I know that this is an expensive navigation aid and certainly is not in the class of the units available for about $200 in discount stores. You know that at sometime in the not so distant future units such as the GPS195 _WILL_ be available for $200.00. cheers, w -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Warren Harhay, System Administrator Access Nevada http://www.accessnv.com "A Dam Site better ISP" Internet host of www.hooverdam.com STOC #174 HSTA #6854 AMA #500320 BMWMOA BMWR BOOF#101 IBA Amateur Radio: K8NPI ARRL/OO From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Wed Jun 4 12:26:25 1997 From: steve.aikensNoSpam@NoSpam3lefties.com Date: Wed, 04 Jun 1997 08:09:23 -0600 Organization: PC Solutions, Inc. To: Bob DeHaney Cc: bmwmcNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Subject: Re: BMW: GPS Receivers Reply-To: steve.aikensNoSpam@NoSpam3lefties.com Bob DeHaney wrote: > > Have any Prezzes experience with these things? Are they useful for ON the > road motorcycle tourers, or just interesting toys? How steep or flat is the > learning curve? Where can I read comparison tests? Recommendations? > > Bob in Munich > '941100RS For a good primer and start go to: http://www.lowrance.com http://www.gpsworld.com/ has more. I use a GlobalMap Sport. I like it. -- I don't suffer from insanity.....I enjoy every minute of it! Steve Aikens, Clovis, New Mexico steve.aikensNoSpam@NoSpam3lefties.com My BMW URL is http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/4323/ Don't drop by very often, it never changes. From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Wed Jun 4 19:02:26 1997 From: steve.aikensNoSpam@NoSpam3lefties.com Date: Wed, 04 Jun 1997 16:30:36 -0600 Organization: PC Solutions, Inc. To: Bill Juhl Cc: bmwmcNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Subject: Re: BMW: GPS Receivers Reply-To: steve.aikensNoSpam@NoSpam3lefties.com Bill Juhl wrote: > > Date: Wed, 4 Jun 1997 15:08:13 +0200 > > From: Bob DeHaney > > Subject: BMW: GPS Receivers > > > > Have any Prezzes experience with these things? Are they useful for ON the > > road motorcycle tourers, or just interesting toys? How steep or flat is the > > learning curve? Where can I read comparison tests? Recommendations? > > > > Bob in Munich > > '941100RS > > Bob, I've spent some time (a couple of Alaska lengthy float trips and > open ocean sailing) with GPS receivers. The problem in using them, is > that you need Latitude and Longitude references in order to relate them > to the map you are using. Until they lay a lat/long grid on road maps, > the GPS units will have less utility then desired. Aviation and maritime > charts have such markings, but terrestial charts are quite lacking. >.............. Although not quite incorrect, not quite correct either, Bill. If you spend the bucks to get a unit that has plotter mapping and inland highway maps (and/or detail maps), you can move to a location on the map, zoom in to the location on the map depending on the degree of accurace you want, enter it as a waypoint and tell the system to navigate to the map point. Although this is an extreme oversimplification of how it's done, it should give you the basics. It is, however, not difficult. > There are systems at some stage of being available that tie GPS to > computer raster maps so that you have the physical metadata relationship > linked. I haven't worked with them, but the display there is going to > be the problem ... unless you are driving a Wing ... I suppose then you > could install the 21" display. These are not reasonable to try to use on a motorcycle. Tying the notebook with Street Atlas or Map N Go to a Garmin 45 works fine for the car but just not doable on a bike. > Most GPS units are quite similar in design, and identical in accuracy, > and probably reliability. 1-2 hours playing with the tutorial that is > included should make you competent. Differences are likely to be in the > ergonometrics. Like most electronic gadgets, they are essentially > identical so they compete by adding more and more features so that their > list is longer than the competition ... whether there is utility or not. If you talk about the lower end units, you're right. They're all about the same. Some use batteries faster than others, have more buttons, etc., but they do the job pretty much the same as the next guys'. When you go to the next level, you get a better, higher resolution screen, more features, and the ability to use pre-defined or at least installable highway maps of anywhere in the world. The maps are the real difference. I have a Garmin 45 (about $175.00 total investment used)and a Lowrance GlobalMap Sport (about $1,000 total investment). There is little similarity between the two. However, accuracy and reliablity are equal between the two units. > So on the "are they useful ON the road" quesiton my take is the answer > is "mostly toy". ...BUT other prezzes probably will explain to me why > this isn't so. :-) Wether these are toys or not is purely subjective. Personally, I think the Garmin is a toy. I don't think the Lowrance is. YMMV. -- I don't suffer from insanity.....I enjoy every minute of it! Steve Aikens, Clovis, New Mexico steve.aikensNoSpam@NoSpam3lefties.com My BMW URL is http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/4323/ Don't drop by very often, it never changes. From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Fri Jun 6 11:10:39 1997 Date: Fri, 6 Jun 1997 16:30:40 +0200 From: Bob DeHaney To: bmwmcNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Subject: BMW: GPS Receivers Reply-To: Bob DeHaney Thanks to all who came back with the good info. I've ordered a Garmin II+ from Commsynsis in Utah. The big problem I see is that nothing as easy or as cheap as Map'nGo exists in Germany. Looks like I'll have to scan my own maps in. Shouldn't be a problem if I spring for the flatbed scanner. Bob in Munich '94 K1100RS From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Fri Jun 6 10:09:49 1997 Date: Fri, 6 Jun 1997 09:25:58 -0400 (EDT) From: Rick Povich To: Internet BMW Riders Subject: Re: BMW: GPS Receivers X: I'd rather be two-wheelin' Reply-To: Rick Povich On Wed, 4 Jun 1997, Bill Juhl wrote about GPS use: > Even the USGS quads have only abbreviated lat/lon marks on the > periphery, as lat/lon was not used for terrestial way-finding > historically until GPS came along. The _easiest_ way to use USGS quads is to use the UTM grids. These are based on the little blue tick marks on the borders of the maps and correspond to 1000 meter square units. UTM coordinates might look something like this: (East) 17T 0684008 (North) 4459650 If you look at the top left portion of your map, you'll see the xxXXxxxm.N. values in the corner, and corresponding to North/South coordinates. The xxx values represent the 1000 meter grids. Along the top and bottom of the map, and corresponding to North/South, are the xXXxxxm.E. values. These numbers will change based on your geographic location, but the method of using them is still the same. Your GPS will display location in UTM format for you and you can enter coordinates into the GPS in the same datum. So, basically, you're looking at locating and navigating 1K grids, which can be reduced to 100 meter grids, as opposed to trying to figure out latitude, longitude, degrees, minutes and seconds. The best thing to do (if you don't mind maarking your maps) is to draw lines across the map using the UTM tick marks, providing yourself with a visible UTM grid you can quickly navigate with. FWIW, I use Delorme Street Atlas to get coordinates for highway routes, then enter them into my GPS for navigating. If you have a windoze version of the program, you can download your waypoints directly to your GPS. Makes route planning much easier. Just remember to set your GPS to WGS84 datum when getting waypoint data from Delorme's products (and most CD-ROM-based maps) So essentially, if you have a USGS quad and figger out how to use the UTM grid, your navigational life will be _MUCH_ easier. You can download UTM grid templates from the following site: Additionally, I got this explanation of the UTM grid from Jerry L. Wahl (jl-wahlNoSpam@NoSpamaccess.digex.net) on the GPS newsgroup (sci.geo.satellite-nav) a while back: ---------------- *** > UTM is a projection and this means a method of > projection the near spherical earth's surface onto > another surface which can be laid flat. In the case of > a mercator projection this is a cylinder. At any rate > almost any projection *IS* skewed relative to lat/long > values. The difference between north in the grid > system and true north is called the mapping angle and > it depends on where you are in the UTM zone. In the > middle they happen to be the same, but east and west of > there they are different by up to 3 or so degrees. > > The USGS maps exterior lines (graticule) are oriented > based on even degrees of lat/long at the appropriate > level 2.5 minutes, 15 or 30 minutes depending on the > map. There is also a little diagram on the bottom of > most of those maps that shows the approximate > relationship between true north, magnetic north, and > grid north for that map. *** ------------------------ Hope that helps a bit. Rick Povich ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Rick Povich University of Pittsburgh Media Producer Audiovisual Department SHUTTER+NoSpam@NoSpamPITT.EDU (814) 269-7103 Johnstown, Pa. 15904 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> < It's not whether you screw up, > < but how you recover that counts > < Squid Factor:18.99 DoD#032653 > <1976 R90/6 1981 R100RT 1991 R100GS/PD > < Paris Daycare Mudbog and Dirt Flingin' Society > < http://www.pitt.edu/~shutter > < N 40 17.697 W 78 59.867 > < Rambling, Chronically Bored #1 > <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Fri Jun 6 10:55:14 1997 Date: Fri, 06 Jun 1997 09:19:58 CDT To: bob.dehaneyNoSpam@NoSpamroses.de Cc: bmwmcNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Subject: Re: BMW: GPS Receivers From: "Stephen D. Erf" Reply-To: "Stephen D. Erf" Bob: My personal experience is highly favorable (Lorrance Globa Map Sport per Arno Jones' web page). I went on my first trip over 150 miles in early May from Chicago to Georgia Mtn Rally. I made it in a day trip down & day trip back using only the GPS. I carried no maps. However, I had used Delorme's Map 'n Go to find the lat/long coordinates for key intersections of the route I planned. The GPS guides of built-in maps of major roads and various compass type pointers were sufficient to go about 700 miles without a mpa & without getting lost once. I'm still amazed at the usefullness. My wife is still amazed I made it. There was a bit of a learning curve. I spent the two weeks before the trip using it to & from work in my car so I wouldn't crash trying to figure it out (or at least get hurt less if I crashed). By the time of the trip it was second nature. The hard part on the bike is an adequate, solid mount. I ended up using "opposing" elastic straps (secured from a boating supply store) wrapped around the tank bag with the GPS on top in an angled plastic bracket. BTW the supply stores here have many more mounting options for the Garmin line of GPS units. It's also great for marking a spot you want to be able to find again or a route you want to be able to retrace. Steve P.S. Having read some of the other messages posted in the interim, I feel luckier than ever! But I would do it again. The key is the built in (and addable (?) in inland highway maps Steve A. refers to.) From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Wed Jun 11 09:57:52 1997 Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 08:49:10 -0400 (EDT) From: Rick Povich To: Internet BMW Riders Subject: BMW: Palmtop GPS systems on the horizon X: I'd rather be two-wheelin' Reply-To: Rick Povich I just read this column from computer columnist Don Crabb about Newton-based (and wince) GPS systems. Looks kinda interesting. And no, it isn't just an "X" with "You are here" under it ;^) FWIW: ************** > TELETYPE GPS TO RELEASE NEW NEWTON AND WINDOWS CE SOFTWARE > > PC Expo has always showcased smaller software developers, and > next week's show at New York City's Jacob Javits Center will be > no different, Crusty has learned. One up-and-coming small > software developer is Teletype GPS. At the 'Spo, they will be > showing new versions of their developing Global Positioning > System software for both the Newton OS and Windows CE palmtops, > The Oracle at Shellphi has learned. > > The new wares support any Newton OS 2.0 device, including the hot > new Message Pad 2000 and eMate 300, as well as any Windows CE 1.0 > palmtop, The Cantankerous Claw-Snapper was told by Teletype GPS > sources. > > Featured will be software & GPS receiver bundles that include > world- wide map overlays (with U.S. Interstate Highways optional) > with any of the GPS receivers sold by TeleType. The GPS software > and mapping program are packaged with a GPS receiver/antenna PC > Card. The database graphically displays city nodes and interstate > roads in real time with the ability to pan and zoom so the driver > (or aviator) can get > her position relative to the map, instantly. Teletype GPS will > post info about the new software/hardware bundles after its New > York intro at http//www.teletype.com/gps. > > After much internal debate (which got "pretty rancorous" > according to one Teletype staffer, thanks to "increased > competition in the GPS market, especially thanks to all those > in-car GPS systems that you can now buy"), they've lowered the > price to the new Teletype GPS software to $195 list. The GPS PC > Card receiver/antenna costs extra, depending upon its additional > features, with bundles starting as low as $395. > > Still, even at $395, the bundle looks like a bargain compared to > the $3,000 pricetag most luxo car dealers are tagging their > built-in car GPS systems with. And that even includes the bucks > you'd pay to buy the Newton 2000 or Windows CE palmtop, The > Watery Wayfarer opines, which gives you much greater GPS and > palmtop utility and flexibility than buying the car versions. > > But, of course, the Beclawed BMW-freak notes, that standalone > option does not integrate it with the rest of the vehicle's > electronics, a justification The Argumentative Arthropod used to > option his new 540i with the aforementioned BMW GPS system. Nor > does the Newton/Windows CE GPSware have the enormous map > databases of the car systems, like the Bimmer's, which use > trunk-mounted CD- ROMs (something no palmtop can ever duplicate). > Teletype GPS to Release New Newton and Windows CE Software. ************* Rck Povich ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Rick Povich University of Pittsburgh Media Producer Audiovisual Department SHUTTER+NoSpam@NoSpamPITT.EDU (814) 269-7103 Johnstown, Pa. 15904 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> < It's not whether you screw up, > < but how you recover that counts > < Squid Factor:18.99 DoD#032653 > <1976 R90/6 1981 R100RT 1991 R100GS/PD > < Paris Daycare Mudbog and Dirt Flingin' Society > < http://www.pitt.edu/~shutter > < N 40 17.697 W 78 59.867 > < Rambling, Chronically Bored #1 > <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Wed Jun 18 01:31:54 1997 Date: Tue, 17 Jun 1997 23:50:36 -0400 To: bmwmcNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com, bmwmcNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com, bmw-gsNoSpam@NoSpammicapeak.com, bmw-r1100NoSpam@NoSpamcinnamon.com From: daliNoSpam@NoSpambridge.net (Dali Meeow) Subject: BMW: Mapping Software + GPS Reply-To: daliNoSpam@NoSpambridge.net (Dali Meeow) Three computer software packages, designed for use with your GPS and note book computer, are reviewed in the July '97 issue of Computer Shopper. Here's my synopsis of a long article that starts on page 226 : Map Compass ($340) will plan your trip, will give real time directions, or will show you what you've done. It's information is downloadable with the Lowrance Explorer. It's the only one that allows you to leave the laptop at home. There are no points of interest and no door-to-door directions; lots of mapping nuances. SkyMap ($300) has lots of points of interest, a vertible tour guide that eats losts of hard drive space, along with the mapping information. The mapping information is not as good as Map Compass. MetroGuide, the most expensive at $549, provides door-to-door directions with maps and "turn left at D Street, drive two blocks, turn right at G Street ..." information given via computer-generated voice. Keep your eyes on the road; you have an Italian mother riding shotgun. Please understand that I don't own a GPS and am presenting this review for those who might be interested in reading the whole article. As usual, I make no claims regarding accuracy or coherence. Stephen, changing litter at 25-deg 34.631' N latitude; 80-deg 20.931' W longitude (in Miami, where it's hurricane season until Thanksgiving), with TRF Dali Meeow, purr-fecting upside down napping while dreaming of elongated handlebar mustaches draped over melting grandfather clocks, and Miss Fluff, guarding the back yard from those ubiquitous back yard thieves. The Redhead - '96 Marrakesh Red BMW R1100RS (Stephen on broad) Scarlet - '89 Red Honda Hawk 650 GT (undergoing rehab) Rolling Writer, IAJS #5, Amateur Gynecology & Espionage From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Thu Jul 17 23:46:41 1997 From: "Pat Roddy" To: "BMW List" Cc: "Georgia Club-The LINE" , "GS List" Subject: BMW: GPS Unit-Garmin 12XL Date: Thu, 17 Jul 1997 23:20:27 -0400 X-Priority: 3 Reply-To: "Pat Roddy" Well folks, ol' pr's 'vacation' is over. I start back to work Monday. I have mixed emotions about it-it has been nice being a 'house-husband for the past several months, but I don't want my clinical skills to get too rusty either. :-) Neither do my patients! Anyway, I rec'd a check from some lectures I did several months ago (academe has never been known to pay off in a timely manner), and with the new job starting next week, I figured I would splurge a little. I have not been able to do that for a LONG time. I reviewed my saved letters from the GS list concerning GPS units, logged onto several websites to read about them again, and decided on the Garmin 12XL. A few calls to local retailers and I found a store that had some in stock (REI). A quick trip down to the store, talked with a young salesman that knew something about the several they had there, and minutes later, was out in the parking lot, locking onto 6 satellites within 30-45 seconds. I was in the Dakota and the unit functioned flawlessly on the way home, lying on the front seat. Miles per hour to the 10'th of a mile per hour (BTW- the Dodges' speedo was never off more than 1.2 mph from 15-80 and was spot on >90% of the time). Total distance to and from, along with atomic clock accuracy timing. Now the big test--early tomorrow I want to check the speedo on the LT. It has always been suspect to me and to countless others here on the list for reading high. I have had several BMW wrenches tell me BMW puts in a 10% fudge factor to make them read high. Now, thanks to the wizardry of modern electronics, I will be able to get an idea of just how far off the LT's speedo is tomorrow. (or how far off MY judgment of its speed is). I plan on carrying my pocket recorder, the one I use when on long solo trips to record whatever comes to mind (and some of it is pretty damn funny, I must admit) to record the differences instead of either trying to remember them all or worse, write them down while at speed. Will give a full report tomorrow, and will then give an evaluation of the Garmin 12XL as soon as I figure out all of its functions. First impression-The Garmin 12XL is a very compact GPS receiver with extremely fast access to as many as 12 satellites at one time (Once, in open space, I had 9 that I was getting data from). Very user friendly, menu driven, and the buttons can be fairly easily accessed with summer driving gloves on. I was able to figure out most of it before looking in the manual too :-) That says a lot right there. More later. pr pr Buford, GA. USA 93K1100LT--long Banzai runs 95 R100GS--goes wherever you point it :-) From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Sun Jul 27 22:40:57 1997 Date: Sun, 27 Jul 1997 21:30:57 -0500 (CDT) From: Geoff Adams To: spikeNoSpam@NoSpamhevanet.com Cc: bmwmcNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Subject: Re: BMW: Mapping Software Reply-To: Geoff Adams On Sun, 27 Jul 1997 spikeNoSpam@NoSpamhevanet.com wrote: > > I have been agonizing over the selection of mapping software and suddenly it > occurred to me that there might be a few prezzes out there with some experience > with the variety of programs available. They all say they will practically hand > deliver you to your destination, but which ones are the most useful? Most > entertaining? Anyone have any opinions? A few months ago this was discussed at length and I concluded that DeLorme MapNGo was making lots of folks happy. I found version 2.0 on sale at Sam's Club and got a copy. I've used mine a lot and am happy with it. But many others were pleased with the alternatives. I'm sure they will speak up. Geoff Adams '85KRS MOA 22753 TBC Arlington, TX IBMWR BMWDFW NTCOF tbcNoSpam@NoSpamdfw.net LSBMWR "We are confronted with insurmountable opportunities!" -Pogo. ____________________________________________________________________________ From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Mon Jul 28 00:40:08 1997 From: "ynotfix" To: Cc: "bmwmc" Subject: Re: BMW: Mapping Software Date: Sun, 27 Jul 1997 21:30:55 -0700 X-Priority: 3 Reply-To: "ynotfix" Spike; I have Travroute's Door to Door program. It was priced cheap, and for good reason: It has a lot of inaccuracies. It will get you there but not without your help. If you get lost easily then I'd stay away from this one. Fortunately I have a great sense of direction and extra good luck finding my way around, something I need with Door to Door! Hope this helps. Tony Angco '96 K1100RS, '96 Triumph Trident 900 '84 Honda XLV750R M/C Krazy " If I can just get off of this (DAMN) L.A. freeway...." Thanks to Guy Clark for the quote. ---------- > Cc: bmwmcNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com > Subject: Re: BMW: Mapping Software > Date: Sunday, July 27, 1997 7:30 PM > > > On Sun, 27 Jul 1997 spikeNoSpam@NoSpamhevanet.com wrote: > > > > I have been agonizing over the selection of mapping software and suddenly it > > occurred to me that there might be a few prezzes out there with some experience > > with the variety of programs available. They all say they will practically hand > > deliver you to your destination, but which ones are the most useful? Most > > entertaining? Anyone have any opinions? > > A few months ago this was discussed at length and I concluded that > DeLorme MapNGo was making lots of folks happy. I found version 2.0 on > sale at Sam's Club and got a copy. I've used mine a lot and am happy with > it. But many others were pleased with the alternatives. I'm sure they > will speak up. > > Geoff Adams '85KRS MOA 22753 TBC > Arlington, TX IBMWR BMWDFW NTCOF > tbcNoSpam@NoSpamdfw.net LSBMWR > > "We are confronted with insurmountable opportunities!" -Pogo. > ____________________________________________________________________________ > From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Mon Jul 28 09:04:08 1997 Date: Mon, 28 Jul 1997 05:41:55 -0700 From: Mark Parker To: bmwmcNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Subject: Re: BMW: Garmin GPS Reply-To: Mark Parker Steve Allen wrote: > Also, where is a discount priced source for the accessories? Steve: I have been doing some Web research on GPS. There is a company in Oroville (about 90 mi north of Sacramento), called NVL&T (North Valley Land & Timber) that sells a variety of GPS systems and accessories. You might want to check them out at http://ww.nvlt.com/index.htm. Their voice number is 916-534-9745. I have not bought anything from them (yet) so Caveat Emptor -- but their prices look good. Regards, Mark Parker Sacramento, CA '95 R1100GS From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Mon Jul 28 10:32:46 1997 Date: Mon, 28 Jul 1997 08:57:42 -0500 From: corkreed To: Mark Parker Cc: bmwmcNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Subject: Re: BMW: Garmin GPS X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Reply-To: corkreed Mark Parker wrote: > Steve Allen wrote: > > > Also, where is a discount priced source for the accessories? > > Steve: I have been doing some Web research on GPS. There is a > company > in Oroville (about 90 mi north of Sacramento), called NVL&T (North > Valley Land & Timber) that sells a variety of GPS systems and > accessories. You might want to check them out at > http://ww.nvlt.com/index.htm. Their voice number is 916-534-9745. I > have not bought anything from them (yet) so Caveat Emptor -- but > their > prices look good. > > Regards, > Mark Parker > Sacramento, CA > '95 R1100GS Boat US has some great buys on electronic gear this month. The usual disclaimers, Corky From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Mon Jul 28 12:20:28 1997 From: "Jay Goldstein" To: "Geoff Adams" , Cc: Subject: BMW: Mapping Software (one Canadian's view) Date: Mon, 28 Jul 1997 10:59:07 -0500 X-Priority: 3 Reply-To: "Jay Goldstein" I recently switched from Automap (Ver.5) to Map'N'Go (Ver.2) sold by the AAA/CAA. Overall, I'm much happier with Map'N'Go (despite its flaws) than Automap. Here are my observations about the two programs. 1) Automap gives you the option of using topographical maps, while Map'N'Go doesn't. That's something I miss. The topographical maps give you a real feel for the terrain a route goes through. 2) There is no contest in terms of how quickly the programs calculate routes: Map'N'Go wins hands down. 3) The database of Canadian cities and towns in both programs leaves a lot to be desired, but at least Map'N'Go uses Canadian highway designations (e.g., provincial highway, provincial road) while Automap ethnocentrically insisted on labelling the TransCanada Hwy. as US 1, and provincial highways as State Routes! On the other hand, although Map'N'Go has nicely detailed street maps of most large US cities, the maps of Canadian cities (including the largest one - Toronto) show only major streets and highways. 4) There are a couple of bugs in Map'N'Go (Ver. 2 ) which are evident if you use the metric system. First, although you have the option of setting up the program to use kilometers rather than miles, "Global Speed Settings" (that are used to calculate driving times) must be input in mph only. Second, if you calculate a route and opt to quick print just the list of directions, the printout shows distances only in miles. An e-mail to Delorme about these bugs brought a reply that they have been addressed in Ver. 3. That's fine for purchasers of Ver. 3, but it doesn't do anything for me. In contrast, Automap handled metric measurements without any problems. Jay Goldstein Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada 1993 R100GS ---------- > From: Geoff Adams > To: spikeNoSpam@NoSpamhevanet.com > Cc: bmwmcNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com > Subject: Re: BMW: Mapping Software > Date: July 27, 1997 9:30 PM > > > On Sun, 27 Jul 1997 spikeNoSpam@NoSpamhevanet.com wrote: > > > > I have been agonizing over the selection of mapping software and suddenly it > > occurred to me that there might be a few prezzes out there with some experience > > with the variety of programs available. They all say they will practically hand > > deliver you to your destination, but which ones are the most useful? Most > > entertaining? Anyone have any opinions? > > A few months ago this was discussed at length and I concluded that > DeLorme MapNGo was making lots of folks happy. I found version 2.0 on > sale at Sam's Club and got a copy. I've used mine a lot and am happy with > it. But many others were pleased with the alternatives. I'm sure they > will speak up. > > Geoff Adams '85KRS MOA 22753 TBC > Arlington, TX IBMWR BMWDFW NTCOF > tbcNoSpam@NoSpamdfw.net LSBMWR > > "We are confronted with insurmountable opportunities!" -Pogo. > ____________________________________________________________________________ > > From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Mon Jul 28 16:27:08 1997 Date: Mon, 28 Jul 1997 10:31:18 -0700 From: "Max C. McHatton" To: spikeNoSpam@NoSpamhevanet.com Cc: bmwmcNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Subject: Re: BMW: Mapping Software Reply-To: "Max C. McHatton" spikeNoSpam@NoSpamhevanet.com wrote: > > I have been agonizing over the selection of mapping software and suddenly it > occurred to me that there might be a few prezzes out there with some experience > with the variety of programs available. They all say they will practically hand > deliver you to your destination, but which ones are the most useful? Most > entertaining? Anyone have any opinions? > > Spike Cornelius > 85 K100(S) > 65 Triumph 500 > Portland,Or Spike, Ihave tried Rand McNally and DeLorme AAA. I am quite satisfied with DeLorme. Igave the other one away. Max From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Sat Aug 9 22:54:41 1997 Date: Sat, 09 Aug 1997 19:44:39 -0700 To: Larry Fears From: Fulton Martin Subject: Re: BMW: Parts is parts Cc: bmwmcNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Reply-To: Fulton Martin X-No-Archive: yes At 08:57 AM 8/9/97, you wrote: >The list will include: (in no particular order) > >GPS Can't say enough good about the Garmin GPS II Plus: 12 channel parallel receiver, locks on in no time and stays locked on (except in the Mobile tunnel), keeps track of 1024 points, either by time or automatically, 500 waypoints, 20 routes, super accurate speedometer, trip meter, average speed, max speed. Wire it into your bike (I can sell you a plug, or a cable, or both to wire it into your bike's 12 volts, and / or hook it up to your computer) and download / upload waypoints-routes-tracks into your computer. Funnest toy I've bought in a long time for $249. Can't help you with the rest, though. BTW, I really enjoyed your Larry & Ted's Excellent Adventure series... --Fulton roseviewNoSpam@NoSpamcts.com on the road, but will return to... San Diego, CA From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Mon Aug 11 09:41:12 1997 From: "drbob27" To: bmwmcNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 07:17:20 +0000 Subject: Re: BMW: Parts is parts (GPS) Reply-To: "drbob27" X-No-Archive: yes > There is a company on the left coast called REI Mountaineering that sells > the Garmin GPS II at around $150 (that's what I paid). They are located in > a number of major cities and do a lot of mail order business. > This is the old single channel model. Works OK with strong signals, but, IMHO, the extra $100 for a 12 channel 12XL or II Plus is well worth it. Someone asked if they had moving maps "like the airplane units". No, their moving map is rudimentary (no database) unless paired with a computer mapping program. bob From Pat Roddy Date: Mon, 18 Aug 1997 17:24:15 -0400 From: "Pat Roddy" Subject: BMW: A visitor from the West (US) One note for you GPS fans--I had my unit on the whole trip with Mick and Mike. Fulton had d/loaded a copy of Waypoint+ onto my computer before he left last week, I uploaded all the waypoints the GPS had stored on our 200 mile foray into WP+, then it automatically (IF DeLorme Street Atlas is already running) lays your route onto DeLorme's maps, changing colors with every food or fuel stop. It is cool! :-) It will be a very good way of keeping up with where you have been, mapping your route, so you can then mark down the good ones and cast aside the not so good roads. (This feature will also work in reverse--map out your route first, then upload to the GPS unit, but I have yet to do that). I can see that this will also be a very handy mapping "tool" (it is NOT a toy) when it comes to going off road with the GS. There are no route signs, gas stations or other landmarks out on the boonies; but with the proper maps and the GPS, it will make mapping and remembering good routes a breeze. From Charles Sturtevant Date: Thu, 28 Aug 1997 15:15:54 -0400 Subject: Re: BMW: Re: BMW Navy screwing with GPS At 11:50 AM 8/28/97 -0600, Jim Normandeau wrote: >Most likely they are screwing with the DGPS system. >You cannot isolate/disrupt the GPS signal to a 150 mile radius >(the svs are 2,000km away), >but you can send send false correction information from the >ground, in that cause you would be back to the +/- 100m accuracy. >(or what ever you receiver claims). > Jim, You can disrupt the GPS signal to a 150 mile radius and they are doing it. It is not done from the satellites, but from the ground. There have been articles in aviation magazines about this and the FAA issued a "Notice to Airmen" concerning this test. The plan is to eventually remove the world-wide civilian inaccuracies so that the GPS system can be used as the center piece for air navigation, to replace ground based systems and allow instrument approaches at even the smallest airports, without a need for expensive ground equipment at each. But before the Department of Defense gives this accuracy to the civilians, it wants to assure that it can screw things up locally on the battlefield. ************************************** Charles Sturtevant 82R100CS BMW MOA IBMWR CFI Rotorcraft Springfield, Virginia ************************************** From peterbeNoSpam@NoSpamerols.com (Peter Jones) Date: Thu, 28 Aug 1997 20:37:12 -0400 Subject: Re: BMW: Navy screwing with GPS Well, as one who's (finally) in the market for his first BMW (after waiting 13+ years!), but not yet an owner, I've been quietly lurking. But now you've done gone and jumped into my backyard, so I gots to speak up: On Thu, 28 Aug 1997 11:50:06 -0600, Jim wrote: >Re: BMW: Navy screwing with GPS > >On Thu, 28 Aug 1997, Charles Sturtevant wrote: >=20 >> GPS users. >>=20 >> If you try to use your GPS receiver today along >> the middle Atlantic states you might find it to=20 >> be completely unusable. The USN is experimenting >> with local disruption of GPS signals within 150 >> nautical miles of Patuxent Naval Air Station in=20 >> Maryland. So don't think your receiver is dying. > >Most likely they are screwing with the DGPS system.=20 The Federally (U.S. Coast Guard) operated DGPS system NEVER intentionally transmits false information. In fact, when the station is healthy and monitored, the ten second integrity spec insures you'll never receive bad information for more than 10 seconds without a user notification alarm. DGPS also provides integrity for individual GPS pseudoranges, which alone can be unhealthy for as long as six hours without alarm. We would never allow anyone to interfere with the DGPS signal itself. GPS interference testing is arguably necessary; DGPS interference testing is not necessary, and would significantly hazard safe navigation. Ensuring safe navigation is one of our primary missions. >You cannot isolate/disrupt the GPS signal to a 150 mile radius >(the svs are 2,000km away), The distances include airborne users, so it would be quite easy to be over 150 miles from the point of transmission and still be interfered with. >but you can send send false correction information from the=20 >ground, in that cause you would be back to the +/- 100m accuracy. >(or what ever you receiver claims). What the receiver claims has nothing to do with real time accuracy, due to S/A, which receivers cannot detect. Thus, your receiver may be reporting a very low HDOP, while indicating coordinates as far as 100 meters from your actual position. In all reality, these interfering tests are *typically* performed with fairly low radiated power, and due to the line-of-sight nature of the signal, affect a fairly small area (for ground based users). All test plans for areas in and around navigable waters are evaluated for their impact on the maritime user by the Coast Guard. We attempt to insure no unsafe situations result from this testing. You can always get a complete and comprehensive status of the GPS & DPGS systems from the U.S. Coast Guard's Navigation Information Service, the official source of information and point of contact for all GPS and DGPS matters. http://www.navcen.uscg.mil/ Now, quick, someone tell me why I shouldn't buy an R1100RT. I'm absolutely in love with her, and if someone doesn't intervene quickly, I'll be in debt again. *8=3DO Peter B. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D | ENS Peter B. Jones | | U.S.C.G. Navigation Center | | Differential GPS Project | | pjonesNoSpam@NoSpamnavcen.uscg.mil | | Soon to be flying on an R1100RT (finally!) | | Does this mean I have to come up with a name? | =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Date: Tue, 07 Oct 1997 14:25:12 -0600 From: Steve Aikens Subject: Re: BMW: GPS RWILES wrote: > > I heard a rumor of a GPS thing-y that actually had ROADS on it! Izzat > ture? Anyone have any info? Hmmm??? Not a rumor. Well, let's see: Lowrance GlobalMap Sport (Which I had) Eagle AccuMap12 (Which I have) Garmin GPSIII Plus others. - -- I don't suffer from insanity.....I enjoy every minute of it! Steve Aikens, Clovis, New Mexico Date: Sun, 23 Nov 1997 06:51:49 -0500 From: RWILES Subject: BMW: Garmin GPS 3 + DeLorme (Long-ish) I've had my Garmin GPS III "Personal Navigator" for about 2 weeks now. Last week, I bought the DeLorme Street Atlas 5.0 street-mapping software. Here are some highlights from an end-user. The GPS III was $379 at Sports Authority. I also bought 2 cigarette- lighter power cords ($24 each). One is plugged into the lighter socket in the K250 (ooops- 325iC) and I took the cigarette-lighter male end off the other one and soldered alligator clips onto the wires; I've got this one on the bike, clipped hot-direct to the battery. The GPS 3 goes through 4 Duracell AA batteries in about 8-10 hours otherwise. Bought the handlebar-mount for the GPS, too ($24), a very secure unit that allows the GPS 3 to clip into the mount and off again quickly. Very trick and secure, would discourage theft. Fits 22mm & 1" bars. The GPS3 has most major US roads in it, but don't expect miracles. It seems to have every US highway, every Fla state highway and state secondary road. It not only provides a 'moving display' map showing position, but a number of other display options including a compass rose with destination bearing, a "road ahead" display showing the track or route (including turns & route changes (to destination) and others. Data windows are user-selectable and interchangeable, and include destination-pointer, speed, odometer, time to destination and/or next waypoint, ETA to destination or waypoint, altitude, avg speed, and so on and on. There are probably 20-25 such datams available, and each screen can show up to 4. Backlight is acceptable for night use, but use the power cable. You can set a destination by lat/long or from the map. "Here to there" destinations do not show actual routes (like street-mapping programs do) but it is still VERY useful to know where one is in relation to the desired destination. When the GPS3 indicates the need for a change of direction, and a likely-looking road appears, take it. After all, this business of moto-touring IS about exploring, yes? But how about harnessing the full power of the Garmin GPS3's 'route' capability?... You can make up your own route manually, adding road-change waypoints by lat/long or map-pointer, but this could take substantial time and labor with a fairly complicated route. DeLorme Mapping (de-lor'-em) offers the Street Atlas 5.0 software (CD-ROM only, $29) with a built-in interface to the Garmin (and many other GPS units - although only Garmin & Lowrance have basemaps with roads, I believe). Garmin sells a PC-to-GPS serial cable for $39. That's all you need. Using the Street Atlas, first set your preferences (interstates, major roads, local roads- Use, Avoid, Either, etc) and then a Start; this can be set by actual street-address, instead of just City. Set your Destination, either by city or actual street-address. Calculate the route using Quickest, Shortest, Preferred or Scenic. Look at it on-screen, add any Stops, side-trips or other changes you may want, and then download the "Route" into the Garmin GPS3. Too easy! Put GPS3 on vehicle, acquire the sats, pull out of the driveway and follow the arrow to the first waypoint (ie, road-change) which will probably be the end of your street. GPS3 will tell you which way to turn and the distance to the next waypoint/road-change. And the next. And the next. Accurate to about 200'. If you select the Road Ahead display rather than the map display, the "road ahead" stretches out ahead of you, with it's various direction changes and waypoints and signposts, giving you a very clear graphic concept of where you are to go, when you must turn, and which way. Selecting between Road ahead and Map is useful and easy to do, even with gloves on. Zoom in and out to find the best scale for where you are. Auto-Zoom is cool, too. Garmin is coming out with it's "Street Pilot" GPS in mid-98, a fuller-feature mapping GPS like ones built into autos. About $800 plus plug-in modules, about 2.5 times as large as the GPS3. Maybe a motorcycle-useful unit, maybe too big. I dunno. This thing is Way Cool! - -- ******************************** Prezz RogerRamJet, IBMWR rwilesNoSpam@NoSpamprodigy.net Lakeland FL "R11S" Date: Mon, 24 Nov 1997 08:20:06 -0500 From: RWILES Subject: BMW: Lat/Long on Rally Announcements Since more riders are going GPS, it might be helpful if Rally Chairs would publish latitude/longitude coordinates along with rally directions. When ytou do so, be sure to specify the format, ie, Xdegrees" yy.zzz' minutes OR Xdegrees.yyyyyy fractions of a degree. The Xdegrees" yy.zzz' minutes is preferred. Searching for a rally-site/rural campground for the first time, at night, in the rain, will be much, MUCH easier with the aid of the little arrow on the GPS pointing the way. FWIW, Citrus Valley Campground-April fools Rally, south of Clermont, FL is: N28"24.286 / W81"41.767 Florida Campland, home of Tent-Pegger, north of Dade city, FL is: N25"28.554 / W82"11.689 Knights Key Campground, GatoRally, Marathon Key: N24"42.390 / W81"07.184 Perhaps MOA ON and OTL could publish occasional sidebars reminding rally chairs to furnish coordinates along with rally directions. ******************************** Prezz RogerRamJet, IBMWR rwilesNoSpam@NoSpamprodigy.net Lakeland FL "R11S" Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 16:36:32 -0500 From: Mike Nolan Subject: BMW: GPS Waypoints Web Page GPS Waypoint Page for keeping up with Rally sites, Dealers, other stuff, is up at, Comments and suggestions welcome. Mike Nolan '95 K1100LT Dallas, GA Date: Sat, 13 Dec 1997 08:42:09 -0500 From: RWILES Subject: Re: BMW: RE: GPS Waypoints Web Page Dendy, John wrote: > > Question, folks. And I'm not trying to be sarcastic or anything, but > do you really need a GPS? What do the people that have them use them for > specifically.... > Well, lemme try to answer. I've had a Garmin GPS III for about a month now. THis GPS is different from (most) all other handheld GPS units in that it has a built-in basemap that shows all major US roads and a good many state and county secondary roads; also shown are virtually all towns, rivers, lakes, RR X, etc. It has 16 levels of zoom, and about 5 different display pages, including a "moving map," a route display page, trip computer, pointer, compass, and so on. Un-programmed, you can navigate by determining where you are in relationship to where you want to go, especially useful in an area with which you are unfamiliar and facing unexpected traffic troubles. It can be programmed with either JUST a desired destination, or with an autual route including up to 500 road/route-changes. DeLorme Steet Atlas 5.0 will download such a route into the GPS III bing-bang-boom, no setup or brainwork required. Just follow the arrow, watch the 'distance to next waypoint' box, and when it says 0.1 miles to go, look for your turn-off. It'll be there (identified, too). Now, it's 9:45pm; you've been on the road since five in the morning. It's fifty-something degrees, raining, and you're looking for a rally-site that is new to you; it's the "Deep In The Woods Family Campground" off some 2-lane road 12 miles out of town. That friendly little green LCD display will be your best friend- as you follow the arrow and/or map and/or route-page (depending upon which gives you the most useful info for that moment), the 'distance to destination' numbers count down, the arrow points ahead, and as the distance falls below half a mile, you start looking. When it says 300 feet, suddenly a worn, faded sign appears through the rain. You're there. The display is backlit (although you had better buy the optional 12v power cord) and is visible and useful (even to the over-40 crowd) when mounted on tankbag or handlebars. Many more uses. Hope this helps. ******************************** Prezz RogerRamJet, IBMWR rwilesNoSpam@NoSpamprodigy.net Lakeland FL "R11S" X-Sender: thsoppeNoSpam@NoSpampop.wxs.nl X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 20:31:38 +0200 To: bmwmcNoSpam@NoSpamlists.ibmwr.org From: Theo Soppe Subject: BMW: Dutch beemers: Going to the "BMW treffen"?? Sender: ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Reply-To: Theo Soppe X-No-Archive: yes X-Bmw-List: Majordomo 1.94.3 X-Web-Page: http://www.ibmwr.org/ X-Copyright: (c) IBMWR and the original author(s). May 31 and June 1 is the BMW-treffen in "Autotron Rosmalen". Find all info at http://www.bmw.nl/nieuws/artikel/index.html?anchor=record Hope to see you there. Theo.