From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Fri May 23 08:21:31 1997 From: JosephVmanNoSpam@NoSpamaol.com Date: Fri, 23 May 1997 07:40:39 -0400 (EDT) To: bmwmcNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Subject: Re: BMW: Re: Prefer K75 to R850 Reply-To: JosephVmanNoSpam@NoSpamaol.com In a message dated 97-05-22 23:52:35 EDT, you write: >R850 felt like I was on marbles instead of in control. The final >straw? Brian says that I am going at least 10 mph slower now and that >he can finally keep up with me on his R100/7. Yikes! So, I guess this >scooter is not for me. I am disappointed, too - it is so nice on the >eyes. With that Olympic paint job, it attracts a lot of attention. Oh >well. I am sad to see it on the block. > >Thanks for asking. > >Sue Rihn-Manke >Beemer Hill, Palmyra, Wisconsin >BMW MOA Ambassador >BMW RA; AMA; Editor, Wisconsin BMW M/C Club; Autobahn Society >1971 R50/5 "The Beast" >1987 K75T "Rock & Roll" >1997 R850 "Oly" > > Sue, it's a shame that you don't love the 850....I went from riding a K75S (among other beemers) to my R1100GS, and I think it's an incredible machine. Absolutely the easiest bike to ride fast I've ever ridden, and the faster you push, the better it gets. My K75S was a pretty sweet ride, with Works rear shock, Progressive front springs, a real handler. But now I get on my brother's K75 when we trade during weekend rides, and I'm amazed at how unsettled the chassis feels compared to the oilhead, though the K75 engine may be one of the greatest things ever put on a two-wheeler (such a shame BMW didn't choose to develop it further with the advances of Telelever and lighter weight materials...) I have to admit that the anti-dive character of the Telelever and the way the suspension communicates so directly with the road took a bit of getting used to. Also, on the new bike even small changes in tire pressure can make a big difference in handling and feel, much more so than on my K-bike, so you may want to experiment a bit with that. After putting 3K on the clock I'm sure you have a pretty good feel for the machine, and you're obviously a pretty experienced rider, but you may want to give it another chance! Best of Luck! Joe Maniaci 96 R1100GSA 96 Dinan M3 From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Thu Jul 10 00:41:21 1997 Date: Thu, 10 Jul 1997 13:53:18 +0930 To: bmwmcNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com From: prmaljNoSpam@NoSpamlux.levels.unisa.edu.au (al jary) Subject: Re: BMW: F650 Oil Change Reply-To: prmaljNoSpam@NoSpamlux.levels.unisa.edu.au (al jary) >Date: Wed, 9 Jul 1997 11:18:31 -0400 (EDT) >From: BlgzaNoSpam@NoSpamaol.com >Subject: BMW: F650 Oil Change >Hi all, I am a proud owner of a new F650st. My question is: How do I access >the Oil Filter on this beast?? I want to be able to change the oil and >filter but I'm not exactly sure where the filter is?? My dealer is about 30 >miles away, a long trip for an oil change. > >Also, I've heard tell of some bikes with oil in the frame of having to go >through a "bleeding" procedure when changing the oil...Bleeding the oil >through the frame and into the engine?? Anyone know if this is something >that has to be done on the 650?? Or do I just drain and poor the oil into >the cap in the frame? > >Thanks in advance for any input....Steve Steve, If you have a web browser try the 'F650 technical tips' at Adrian Jowett's page, http://www.shef.ac.uk/misc/personal/md1akj/javascri/motocy/tech1.htm#oil. al jary (F650) Adelaide, South Australia From ibmwrNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com Thu Jul 17 02:55:41 1997 Date: Wed, 16 Jul 1997 22:50:21 -0800 To: bmwmcNoSpam@NoSpamworld.std.com, bmw-gsNoSpam@NoSpammicapeak.com, airheadsNoSpam@NoSpammicapeak.com From: kariNoSpam@NoSpamcalbmwtriumph.com (Kari Prager) Subject: BMW: An F 650 G/S Project (long) Cc: rodNoSpam@NoSpamcalbmw2.vip.best.com, dahammrrNoSpam@NoSpamaol.com, partsNoSpam@NoSpamcalbmwtriumph.com, kariNoSpam@NoSpamcalbmwtriumph.com, psdNoSpam@NoSpamcalbmwtriumph.com Reply-To: kariNoSpam@NoSpamcalbmwtriumph.com (Kari Prager) An F 650 G/S is easy to build. These are my rough caption notes for an ON photo shoot we just did of a project bike meant to exceed the fun and performance of the R 80 G/S. The photos, taken by Chris Springmann, are of an F 650 G/S Project bike recently completed at California BMW Triumph for Derek Meyer. The objective was to make the F 650 more suitable for dual sport and desert riding without sacrificing reliability and street comfort. Derek has already ridden the stock F 650 on a Sierra dual sport ride (Reno 200) and knew it could easily be improved. Derek, Eli Ohlhausen, Pat and Kevin Caselli, Kevin Johnson and Kari Prager all contributed ideas to the project. We performed the following modifications: For better handling and dirt performanc we decreased front sprocket size one tooth. (This also allowed the rear wheel to be moved back for better knobby tire clearance.)We removed the plastic chainguard, cut and welded new mounts on the swingarm and replaced with aluminum IMS chain guard and disc guard, and installed a rim lock on rear rim. We replaced the Michelin T 66's with 130/90-17 Pirelli MT 21 and installed 21" EXCEL rim and 90/90 -21 Pirelli MT 21 on the front. We removed the centerstand and replaced the stock footbrake pedal end by welding on an MSR folding pedal end, welded on extended footpegs with White Bros. footpeg extenders and replaced factory skidplate and engine protectors with a White Bros. XR 650 L aluminum skid plate. (Modification to skidplate needed.) Kevin made a rear brake master cylinder guard from the original BMW chain guard, and it looks perfectly stock. An MSR "Brake Snake" brushguard was added to the shift lever.Kevin also fabricated an aluminium fork brace/fender mount to hold a modified Acerbis front fender. For range, comfort and appearance we installed an Acerbis 7 gallon fuel tank, Acerbis Hand Guard/Turn Signal Brush Guards, Pro Taper Handlebars, Scott grips and Endura Engineering electric grips We also used Acerbis flexible rear turn signals, Wuedo "Carbon fiber" frame guards and trimmed the rear fender. We replaced the front turnsignals with amber reflectors, since the Acerbis handguards have turnsignals built in. Finally, we installed a Staintune muffler (lighter, more throttle response and sounds better). We modified and recovered the stock seat to flatten out the "valley" and make it easier to change position and slide up on the tank. We adjusted the suspension, which will soon be upgraded with RaceTech valving, replaced the front brake line with Stainless Steel line and replaced the stock 13mm master cylinder with Brembo 11mm master cylinder and adjustable brake lever. An auxiliary cooling fan switch (in addition to but independent of themostat) was installed to keep temperatures down when riding slowly in rough terrain. Result: A lighter, more responsive 650 with more range, comfort and much better dirt capability, and only slightly reduced street capability. MT 21's look like knobbies, but are DOT legal and work amazingly well on the street, althoughthey don't last as long as street tires. Final suspension modifications must be tested thoroughly before we are ready to offer them as a RaceTech service package, and fork protectors and radiator guards remain to be finalized. Technical work performed by Kevin Johnson, in the California BMW Service Department, and by Advanced Welding. All components (except the fork brace) are available from California BMW Triumph or your dealer. Kari Prager All the best, Kari [Kari Prager, California BMW Triumph, 2490 Old Middlefield Way, Mountain View, CA 94043 415.966.1183/966 8340 FAX, E-mail to , use for orders or shop business. Our website is at www.calbmwtriumph.com] *** Summer Party & Cruiser Intro - July 19th. Date: Tue, 30 Sep 1997 08:57:47 -0400 From: "Scott C. Adams" Subject: Re: BMW: Say Farewell to the F650ST FakeTreeNoSpam@NoSpamaol.com wrote: > I was hanging out at Bob's BMW on Saturday. The head service > technician told > me that the F650ST will not be sold in the U.S. after this year's > (1997) > model. My wife just bought one. I think it's a great bike for women > (particularly petite women) but one of the BMW sales reps told me that > the > 650s are not selling well. I guess there aren't enough petite women > that buy > 650s. > JB > 1997 R850R Just so you dont accidently spread the wrong rumor. My understanding is that the ST model is being discontinued here, the 650 will still be sold. - -- *********************************************************************** ** SCOTT ADAMS (KB8PRS) or FRANCES ADAMS (KB8PRL) ** ** adamsesqNoSpam@NoSpamgwis.com fwaNoSpam@NoSpamsbstone.com ** Date: Sun, 26 Oct 1997 06:41:14 -0500 From: RWILES Subject: BMW: F650 Fork Boots TLN's F650 ST was beginning to collect a couple of stone-nicks on the fork-legs, and I well know the damage to fork-seals done by baked-on Love Bugs (you non-Floridians- you just don't know!) so I asked my dealer for some fork-boots. Fred at 441 Cycle sent up what look like /5 13-rib fork boots; said he thought they'd fit. And they do. Ever seen those really trick plastic ratcheting hose clamps? Way cool. - -- ******************************** Prezz RogerRamJet rwilesNoSpam@NoSpamprodigy.net Lakeland FL "R11S" Date: Wed, 29 Oct 1997 23:28:50 -0500 From: russell.miller-jrNoSpam@NoSpamjuno.com (Russell E Miller-Jr) Subject: Re: BMW: f650 luggage questions and tranny trouble update My 1997 F650ST also has problems going into first on the down shift. I thought some of the problem was due to the cluth lever free play being too much. But, the problem continues. So, my guess is this is a "feature" which is shared by more than one F650. E.G. a tranny defect! Russ Miller 1997 R1200C 1997 F650St 1996 R1100RTL Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 20:35:25 -0500 (EST) From: Larry Fears Subject: BMW: F650gs... Baby GS(long) I just picked up my new F650 this past Saturday and I thought I would share with you guys my first impressions. First as I have already posted, I bought this bike to fill a perceived niche I felt lacking in my life. Up to this point I have never seen the need for a second bike but I've just signed another years consulting contract that has me commuting into the combat zone known as our nation's capital everyday. With less time for trips I want to do more commuting so I was looking for a smaller, lighter bike to do some combat commuting. Little did I know I was going to have so much fun once I got outside of the city. But I get ahead of the story. Thanks to Bill Shaw we had quite a few people show up at Morton's on Saturday morning to see me pick up this little beauty. I would like to attribute this to my shining personality, legendary reputation and good looks but I suspect most of these guys just wanted to see if the suspension would really hold my almost 300 lb frame. :-) Jeff and Steve decided that the response from folks coming down for this send off was so good that they would change their original plans and open the shop for the day. Little did they know that these are my friends, which means they drank a lot of coffee, ate a lot of donuts but didn't buy much. :-) Oh well, don't fret Steve I see that look in Graling's eyes. He'll come around soon. Just keep a line on a red R11RT for him. ;-) Anyhoo, as I was riding the LT down to Morton's I have to admit that I was a bit apprehensive. Do I really need 2 bikes? Was this going to be too small? Did I really need to spend this much cake for a 650 just so it has a roundel on the tank? Problem was that I had already committed to buy it. No I hadn't signed anything, and I even forgot to send my deposit before I left for vacation but I had given my word. And on that word Steve and Jeff painted the bike blue for me and had installed heated grips, hand guards, an accessory socket and jesse panniers. These guys are first rate and I intended to live up to it. As it turned out as I swung into the parking lot all of my apprehensions melted away and was replaced with anticipation. First thing I did was to pull my LT around back by the shop as I haven't broken the news of the new bike to her just yet. I think she suspects though as the speedo failed on the way down there as a way of getting back at me. How to tell her that she is only in for a much needed service and to have the behemoth 8.5 gallon tank painted? Well, that is another post. Soon there after I signed all of the paperwork and it was time for the new ride tech talk from Steve. It was very similar to THE talk dads are supposed to administer to all teenagers. At least as I imagined it must be as the extent of my father's sex talk to me and my brothers was, "If ya get her pregnant don't bring her home." Anyway I half listened to every thing Steve was telling me and excitedly jumped on to ride over with the crew for the congratulatory lunch. The guys in the shop at Mortons had really outdone themselves detailing my new bike. The prettiest shade of blue you ever want to see and everything shining in the sun. Of course I couldn't resist that huge puddle on the way out of the lot so I christened her with the first mud before I even got her clear of the lot. I was feeling so good I bought everyone lunch. Sorry if you missed that because you know my frugal soul is only going to do that once a decade. :-) After lunch all the old married guys were close to their curfew and had to get back so I set off by myself to get to know this little gs. My first impressions had me grinning ear to ear. I just got back from a 3100 mile Christmas/Reindeer Ride and was actually used to the bulk of my LT so my first sensation was like I was riding a moped. But no Moped I know of has this amount of pep even keeping her below the 5k break in RPM limit. This is one of the most "flickable" bikes I have ever owned. As I think about it I have ridden/owned nothing smaller than 1000cc since I got and rebuilt my Kawasaki Z-1 900 (which I bored out to 1050cc) when I was 19. Man, little did I know what I have been missing. The rest of the day was pretty tame as I spent most of the day riding to various friends houses showing her off. Sunday dawned early and beautiful and the weather man was predicting high 60s and I was ecstatic. I awoke before the alarm and set off to the mountains of West VA that are but a 45 minute ride from my front door. Now I was really having fun. I started to explore roads I would never even think of going down on my LT. It had snowed in the middle of the week and most of the roads were only semi paved so the bike was covered in mud in short order. I didn't get her stuck but managed to bog her down a little in one particularly soupy section of this back road I had found. I have got to find a way to mount my GPS III to this thing as it would be perfect. My mother believed(s)that motorcycles are death machines and as such I missed out on the dirt bike scene when I was a kid but seeing how as I am too fat and out of shape for stump jumping now I think this little gs will do just fine. I know that when many think of enduro type riding and BMW the first bike mentioned is the R11GS. But personally I think it would be psychotic to take a behemoth like the R11GS and zip it down the roads I was going on. I considered the R11GS but it was to heavy, I couldn't flat foot it, and I couldn't see me thrashing down a fire road on a $12k motorcycle. On the other hand my mini gs is light and nimble and I can easily flat foot her. And with a curb weight of 400 lbs I should be able to pull her out of anything I am dumb enough to get her into. Ride, fit and finish? I am very pleased with the looks and think the Jesse bags look trick on this bike. Of course I love the blue color, at least what I can see under all of the mud. :-) The heated grips are better than the ones on my LT which was surprising. I am glad I decided on the accessory plug as I have gotten spoiled sitting behind the barn door fairing of the LT. I nearly froze my petunias off until I stopped and put on my heated jacket. Not much wind protection from that little fairing. Also I own a DuoTech and now I know what all you guys were talking about when you said it was a noisy helmet. But as long as I make sure that my ear plugs "seat" correctly before riding off it really isn't that bad. This bike doesn't like being lugged. You must keep her above 3k rpm or she really complains. Trying to keep her under the 5k break in limit is a bit of a challenge but something I won't have to worry about for to long as I am at about 400 miles after my first 2 rides. My chief complaint is with the "a" typical crappy BMW saddle. I'm a 3rd generation German- American but my butt must not be like the ones grown in the father land as I was squirming after 75 miles. I don't plan to change it right now as this isn't going to be a bike that I Iron Butt on so I'll spend that money else where. Also I think the gas capacity is pathetic. I had to go to reserve at 154 miles and then was only able to squeeze 3.4 gallons in. I'm going to try to remove the flapper like I did on my LT and see if that helps. It vibrates a bit but nothing more than I expected from a big single and I suspect some of that will go away after break in. I think the braking is adequate but I am spoiled by the ABS, twin rotors on my LT. Still I think the single disk should perform a bit better. My only other nitpick is the same as all other BMW's I have ever owned. You would think the bean counters could figure a way to work into the price some better lighting, both front and rear. I wonder if they make priority lights for this little gs. Oh yeah, the switches are placed very well with the trigger like high beam flash switch being my favorite. The turn signals are reminiscent of my Jap bikes and I can see where it might get a bit confusing switching back and forth but nothing I can't live with. All in all I love this bike and am planning on having lots of fun exploring. My LT will always be my first choice for piling on the thousand mile days but I think this baby gs is going to give me lots of grins for years to come. BTW, I have left out any discussion of the chain as I am too new to say what the maintenance is going to be. BMW is very vague in this area saying only to oil it regularly. Once I start commuting regularly I will be putting about 350 miles a week on it so I figure I'll just spray it once a week. Hope this helps someone decide on buying one of these little beauties and please forgive me for the length of this diatribe. Should anyone be interested in seeing some pics from Saturday go to http:\\www.cap1000.org\larry. Happy trails..... Larry Fears lgfcoNoSpam@NoSpamerols.com '93 K1100LTA "Blue Max"- My first choice for piling on the miles. '97 F650gs - Hmmm... I wonder if I can take it into those mud bogs? '92 Mazda Miata "Half Cage" - Most fun I've ever had on 4 wheels Gaithersburg, MD AMA, MOA, BMWBMW, SOD #5, Reindeer Rider BMWBMW Rides Chairman, Rolling Broccoli Rider Entrant in 1999 Iron Butt *** "This whole working thing really gets in the way of my riding."- Me*** ************ Rallymaster for the Capitol 1000 ****************** A premier 24 hour endurance rally run June 6-7, 1998. http://www.cap1000.org **************************************************************** ------------------------------